Talent Report+THRIVE

How HR Helps Managers Manage

Description: In this episode, we delve into the crucial role of HR in empowering managers to excel in their leadership roles. We explore the various facets of HR support, from department alignment to performance management and employee development, providing listeners with actionable insights and practical steps to enhance their management skills and foster a thriving, engaged workforce. Join us as we unlock the secrets of "How HR Can Help Managers Manage"!
Resources:
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - DQ Spencer 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - DQ Spencer 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:49:14UnknownNow it's time to thrive. Well, hello everybody, and welcome to this episode of 30 Minute THRIVE. Thanks for joining us today. I'm excited for our conversation today because you get to hear from DQ spencer. DQ is an mra. HR Business partner located in our golden valley, minnesota location. But i know you come with a lot of experience and enthusiasm, especially for our topic today, how our can help managers manage.
00:00:49:16 - 00:01:06:08UnknownSounds like a big topic, but I'm excited to kind of break it down. I know we're going to run through a lot of aspects of HR and kind of give our listeners some good action items and stuff so that they can walk away with. So I know this is your first time on the podcast, so I appreciate you come on and excited.
00:01:06:10 - 00:01:26:20UnknownAwesome. Me too, hi podcasters. I know that you recently spoke at an event on this topic actually. So before we kind of kick things off, I'm just curious to know why is this really an important topic for our listeners? Yeah, I know you're right. I did speak on the event. It was an awesome event.
00:01:26:20 - 00:01:49:13UnknownA lot of energy and enthusiasm. This is a very important topic because a lot of organizations are still struggling with aspect of the function of HR organizations talking about people and people assets being the most important aspect of the company. But they have a hard time showing that people are, because they're the only nonrenewable asset that organizations have.
00:01:49:15 - 00:02:15:23UnknownYou can't copy the processes, equipment, technology, terminology, but you can't really copy people. So that's why this one is very important. Yeah, that's a great point as we kind of dive in. Now, can you explain how HR really collaborates with managers to emphasize their functional strengths? And kind of part two of that question is how can they use those strengths with their teams to achieve those organizational goals?
00:02:16:00 - 00:02:37:16UnknownYeah, So as you know, I don't know. I don't know. I have a football background. I like to use sport terminologies. That's great. Yeah, Yeah. So, I mean, HR is part of a team, right? HR is one of the few functions that truly supports the whole organization. So they have knowledge throughout each function, but they're not be the subject matter expert on that function.
00:02:37:16 - 00:02:50:12UnknownRight? So to probably collaborate with them, you have to just include that clue to include them in our communication conversation and work to collaborate and build that functional component.
00:02:50:14 - 00:03:19:12UnknownSpeaking of teamwork, we're in a world where teamwork is crucial. So how can HR departments kind of facilitate collaboration among their employees and help managers foster that culture of cooperation and teamwork and collaboration? Yeah. So that collaboration comes from that communication, right? And so a big part of HR is communication, and it's talking to the employees, talking to the supervisors, the managers, the leads.
00:03:19:14 - 00:03:43:09UnknownIt's really getting to know your people, your biggest assets. HR is a science and that you'll understand that. I mean, as HR, you have that strength, you have that background of understanding people behaviors, thought processes, patterns and processes. But as a as a functional leader, let's say, in accounting or finance, your your, your function, your strengths are going to be with that.
00:03:43:11 - 00:04:03:17UnknownSo you can you can collaborate with them and to partner with them, engage them. You have to communicate, you have to get in there, you have to go to them. You have to understand what the culture is and how you can THRIVE that. Those behaviors in and and processes to to and build and engage their culture properly. Absolutely.
00:04:03:17 - 00:04:26:22UnknownAnd I know as an HR business partner, you work with a lot of different companies, a lot of different HR department. So do you have any examples or success stories, I would say, of kind of where the HR departments work with teamwork and kind of fostering that collaboration? Yeah, I don't know. Somewhere along the line, HR has gotten such a bad rep as as the good Lord.
00:04:27:01 - 00:04:48:07UnknownYep. And I've been in HR for about 16 years. I have my my Bachelors of Science in HR McMaster Science and during my doctorate business in HR. And through that, I've learned a lot. But I've also learned just as much through my experience. For example, I worked with an organization known, as you mentioned previous to me joining in.
00:04:48:09 - 00:05:21:12UnknownIt was a very strong union environment and that created a kind of trifecta. Three headed obstacle course because it was the union, it was the business, the factory manufacturing, and it was HR and that's how they viewed it as three different portions, three different aspects of business. And that was a very tall task. So I really had to go in there and work on our collaboration first, partnering with the organization, the plant manager, building that relationship, and then partnering with building that relationship.
00:05:21:14 - 00:05:41:10UnknownAnd I was kind of that liaison that brought it all together, you know, that that organization lacked trust amongst the three. So that was that was very challenging. But just working with them, showing my commitment, my dedication, my, my, my, my processes and my procedures, showing them that, hey, you know this, we're a team. We want the same goal.
00:05:41:14 - 00:06:11:01UnknownWe set different paths to get there. Yeah, I'm sure a lot of our listeners can kind of resonate with that and relate to that story too, and how their organization like that. So that's good advice. But we also know that compliance is also a critical aspect of HR, too. So do you have any insights on how HR can support managers and ensuring their teams adhere to the regulations and policies that always seem to be changing and updating?
00:06:11:03 - 00:06:36:13UnknownYeah. Yeah. So I'm going to kind of get off topic, but get back to topic is going to be. So when I first started in the HR, I tried to assimilate to that that stereotype, that prototype of a human resource manager saying no and yes, and you can't do this and you can't do that. And I wasn't truly myself and I truly started being successful when I started, you know, venturing on and being original.
00:06:36:15 - 00:06:54:04UnknownSo I took the mindset of that. I wasn't going to tell leaders and managers, No, you can't do this Right off the bat. I was going to tell them, Hey, I want to get that goal that you want, but here's how we can do this. Here's how we can get it done versus knowing. Yes. So it's compliance. It's the same kind of issues in that aspect versus telling them no or yes.
00:06:54:06 - 00:07:13:06UnknownI'll give them parameters and say, Hey, I see what you're trying to do. This is the most compliant and best way to get there. So let's get it done together. Yeah. So, so running through kind of the task of all the tasks of HR, another one is to motivate employees, which can be kind of difficult. So how can HR
00:07:13:06 - 00:07:41:05UnknownProfessionals and managers work together to keep their teams engaged and motivated? That's that's a tough one, right? Because, you know, I say this all the time is that we're called individuals for a reason. So we're usually created in the we have individual values and views and perspectives. So to have that motivation, it's going to take really knowing and building a relationship with your organization, your culture and your employees.
00:07:41:07 - 00:08:00:07UnknownSo know your employees. One thing I told a member that I talked to, you know, he asked me, how can I motivate my employees? What's going on? They're not gauging. And I you know, I sat there and I said, Hey, you mind if I watch it for a little bit? Watch for a little bit? No problem. No problem.
00:08:00:09 - 00:08:21:09UnknownSo I sat down and took half the morning and just kind of watch his interactions with the employees. And I literally told him, I said, I saw four separate times where people were trying to talk to you and you didn't talk to people trying to walk. My actually, I didn't even look at and on two separate times we were trying to talk to you and you said, you know, you're busy with tomorrow.
00:08:21:11 - 00:08:42:10UnknownI said, Engagement goes both ways, motivation goes both ways. You have to go and engage with them. Right. As a position of authority. Naturally. I think the way people are going to be timid to engage with you so that you have to said that you're setting a standard. Like I said, the engagement and motivation goes both ways. Show them that you're willing to do what you're asking them to do.
00:08:42:12 - 00:09:02:17UnknownYeah, absolutely. I feel like that's a good point. I know a lot of companies right now just have to kind of reevaluate what they're doing. Like you kind of sat in as a fly on the wall and you were able to see it. The HR department may not be able to see it because they're in it. So sometimes you kind of need an outsider almost to come in and see that.
00:09:02:17 - 00:09:32:14UnknownALL Yeah. So when it comes to achieving results, alignment with an organization is key, obviously. So how can HR create that alignment between different teams and departments? Yeah, so alignment comes out. You know, I talked about inclusion, communication, conversation alignment comes with understanding the goal, right? And creating processes and procedures that align with that, that THRIVE toward that goal.
00:09:32:16 - 00:09:55:11UnknownA lot of companies have processes just because they happen. They said, we always have this or this is what we were always. But your goal changed, the business changed. You know, the world of business is very dynamic. It's always changing for you to keep the same processes. It might not make sense to achieve that goal. So I always tell the people, you know, look at what you're trying to achieve, work backwards and this is what we want it.
00:09:55:14 - 00:10:15:18UnknownThis is what we want to achieve. So let's do this. This, this is to get there versus, well, let's do this and go kind of around it, you know, align toward that goal, direct your process, your behavior and your diet and your actions toward achieving that ultimate goal. And just what you said right there, the world of business is very dynamic.
00:10:15:18 - 00:10:47:18UnknownSo I guess that kind of brings us to our next point of how can our assist managers in adapting their strategies and tactics to meet new challenges when business is always changing? Yeah, it's just constant reassessment, right? So like I said, I've been organizations all different functions and industries, and the thing I hear the most is this is how we've always done it or this is what they told us to do versus, you know, having that critical thinking skills, thinking about, hey, this is what they told us to do.
00:10:47:18 - 00:11:03:20UnknownAnd so I was done it. But it doesn't kind of make sense. We're trying to do so we're going back to think about this is what we're trying to we're trying to achieve organic business. We're trying to grow. We're trying to we're trying to set customers and employee satisfaction. So what can we do to get better? Understanding your culture.
00:11:04:01 - 00:11:26:13UnknownCulture is big, so I don't know if you know that I'm a teacher as well. Professor There's that. There's perio, pedagogy and anthropology. The type of learning that adults when when they learn, they want to learn by seeing what you do and looking what you do versus when you're a kid, you do this because you're told to do because you have to go through this.
00:11:26:13 - 00:11:43:23UnknownYou have to work through school, you have to go to high school as adults. They're there because they only want to be there. So let's make it a department that they want to be there right there. It's going to be changing. Not everyone's going to be the same, just like business is going to be evolving. It's going to be dynamic.
00:11:43:23 - 00:12:12:02UnknownIt's going to be contemporary. Some things may stay traditional, but it's going to move. You have to move with flexibility. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I should have mentioned that you were a teacher in the beginning too. I got so many different perspectives now from, well, we've kind of mentioned this throughout the whole podcast, but it seems like employee engagement is often one of the biggest concerns for managers.
00:12:12:04 - 00:12:44:19UnknownSo and you've touched on this briefly, but how can it really assist in measuring and improving employee engagement then to enhance team performance in an organization? Yeah, and that's that's a tough question, right? Because everyone is going to be different. But the thing it can say is, you know, just like business and sales engagement is building relationships, then understanding where you're talking to, what you're talking about, understanding the optimal goal and just building everybody should go toward it.
00:12:44:19 - 00:13:09:14UnknownAnd earlier, making that effort to engage with their employees, making that effort to be as transparent. That's transparent as possible. And so you can't be completely transparent all the time, but be as open as possible because more people understand them more than want to THRIVE that goal and helping them get those fingerprints and open and get that engagement and touchpoints within that plan.
00:13:09:16 - 00:13:28:24UnknownAnd that also helps, you know, they have a little skin in the game that will help them engage and help them. So, you know, I'm a part of this, right? But it starts and starts with the culture. And how is your culture is an engaging culture. Is it an open door culture? Is it, hey, I know we're business here, but how is your day and how are you doing?
00:13:29:01 - 00:13:45:18UnknownLook at the example I gave previously. When a manager, you know, shoot people off or was too busy to talk to people or, you know, he walked from his office right to where he needs to go at to engage. You have to show them this is what engagement looks like. You have to show that, hey, I'm motivated to do my job.
00:13:45:18 - 00:14:13:12UnknownYou have to think, what do you think about this? Talk to them and increase that communication, increase that inclusion and then kind of full support. HR Is a big portion of that because a lot of people really don't have that perspective or understanding or mindset. And as a human resource manager, we understand that people are our business and people should be everyone's business because that's what business is created on.
00:14:13:14 - 00:14:40:05UnknownEven even technical businesses, even process oriented businesses. They're all about people, right? We understand our people. The more we can utilize to take advantage of how great that asset can be and how much we can get to them, how much they can get does Yeah, absolutely. I love that you emphasized the importance of culture and having a good culture because that honestly THRIVEs your organization.
00:14:40:05 - 00:15:07:23UnknownAnd you can tell on day one and even probably both before you work at the organization what their culture is because she's a very prominent thing in an organization. So it's like, you know, example that I give, which I've seen many times, is when you're interviewing people, show their best in the best of times and say, Hey, we're going over their culture where, you know, we want to hear everything you're saying.
00:15:08:00 - 00:15:40:02UnknownBut when you start, it's absolutely And I walk down the hall, every door was closed, closed door meetings, Everything feels like it's secretive. It feels like you're very being excluded. And that's absolute culture. So part of my research for my my doctorate was how to decrease turnover. The intention was really, truly millennials because I do my research on generation, but in how to decrease turnover intentionally with the number one decrease, there was the culture right?
00:15:40:04 - 00:15:56:16UnknownAre you saying you do or are you being transparent? Are you including is are you hiring and retaining people? You need to cultivate that culture and that's a big thing is if you don't have a culture where you if you don't have what you want now, that's not a big deal. A lot of lot religion are in there.
00:15:56:20 - 00:16:18:03UnknownThey don't have what they want to go. They want to achieve. So but how are you going to get that right? What's your plan and how are you communicate and really in that plan, to your people, to your to your managers, and how are they acting on that? Well, you know, it's one thing to say it, but it's another thing to actually let them go.
00:16:18:03 - 00:16:43:00UnknownI know you've given a ton of best practices and advice and tips throughout this whole podcast, but do you have any best practices for HR Professionals to really identify and leverage the functional strengths with within their organization to THRIVE that success that everybody wants? Yeah. Yeah. So a lot of times i will say this is a very known saying, but get comfortable with being accountable.
00:16:43:04 - 00:17:15:01UnknownRight? So a lot of times when you talk the functions this is my first experience with my career when I taught the different functions and I wasn't prepared to talk to them about their business or their function. And so that decreased their trust and decrease their trust in me. So the more time to understand it and functions, I can have a direct conversation with about what their strengths were and and they can see that I'm taking that action to really understand what their strengths are and what their function is and what their goal is.
00:17:15:01 - 00:17:43:14UnknownAnd the more I understood how they act, how they behave, what their processes were, the more I could create strategy to more insert myself into their function and help them grow. And it helped me grow so much. Understand business financially, understand business through the processes of manufacturing, understand business details and marketing. But I just, you know, like I said, part of the reason why I got my BBA was because I had a master's in science, which is great.
00:17:43:17 - 00:18:11:11UnknownBut I want to understand business as a whole more holistically. And that helped me grow so much, helped me grow immensely understanding different functioning business. And that's what I would give to each age and professional in any, anyone, any function. I try to learn business. Don't try to, you know, obviously, you know, you do. You're your expert at what you do, but be an expert at understanding the business and that will help you grow with your organization.
00:18:11:11 - 00:18:30:01UnknownThere's so much that is great advice. That's something that I'm trying to do too, is just even shadowing an apartment for a day to see what their day in the life is. And that, like you said, will help you understand the business as a whole and will help you do your job better, too, on the long run. Yeah.
00:18:30:01 - 00:18:48:20UnknownYeah. And with that is I know it sounds boring, but you know, what do you what's, what's going on in that meeting. I said in that meeting where. Hey, you mind if I, you know, tag along with you? Like I said, Do you mind if I show you? Do you mind if I hang out and kind of the following a little bit and understand what you're going through so I can better help you, better assist you and better support you.
00:18:49:01 - 00:19:09:00UnknownAnd that's what it's about. You know, selfishly, I was trying to grow the business, not trying to grow myself, so I was trying to be a better project, better employee and a better person and more advanced to business. Absolutely. Well, as we wrap up your last question, can you share any key takeaways for our listeners on how HR
00:19:09:00 - 00:19:38:00UnknownCan really be that strategic partner in helping managers manage effectively and achieve the optimal results in their organizations. Bring it full circle here. We'll circle sort of our circle like i would say, kind of like I said, understand the business more. You understand that business and that function and that environment, the more alignment you can create, right? So again, help them understand processes that they don't know the process of, hey, this is what we're doing.
00:19:38:02 - 00:20:08:20UnknownIs that process, that HR Role. When i don't understand it, then they probably won't rule it out to the best of their ability. They probably won't engage in it to the best of your abilities. So help them understand it, right? Understand their business. They can understand your business. Say that that alignment, that inclusion, you know, still in their meetings, our conversation with them, engage with them, go out of your way, you know, go beyond a little bit to make them feel, you know, that they trust you, that the understanding that they believe in you.
00:20:08:22 - 00:20:30:23UnknownBecause the more trust, more understanding, the more inclusion you have, more transparency, you'll get more engaging, you'll get, the better you be able to help them and support them. And the more the business will be able to grow and that's what it's about, is creating that organic growth and that internal growth as well as that external world. So you can be successful in the business, can be successful decades.
00:20:31:00 - 00:20:54:01UnknownThis was great. I want to thank you for being on the podcast today and sharing all that great content and all the advice on how HR Can really help managers manage. So to our listeners, i would just encourage you if you liked our chat and topic today, comment something new that you learned today or something that you're going to start implementing or anything else that you'd like to add on to the conversation.
00:20:54:01 - 00:21:18:04UnknownWe want to know your thoughts, what you're thinking. If you have any new ideas on this topic. And don't forget to share out this episode, of course, and consider joining MRA if you aren't a member already. We have all the resources you need in the show notes below. We've also included resources on this topic and DQ's contact info and LinkedIn profile if you want to connect with him.
00:21:18:06 - 00:21:39:18UnknownOtherwise, thank you so much for tuning in today and we will see you next week. And that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect for more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA's 30 minutes THRIVE so you don't miss out.
00:21:39:18 - 00:21:44:11UnknownThanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

Embracing Authenticity: The Key to Immediate DEI Progress

Description: Join us as we explore the transformative power of authenticity and immediate action in the realm of Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) with leader, speaker, and author, Jess Pettitt. In this thought-provoking episode, we delve into the “Good Enough Now” philosophy, its impact on personal growth, and its potential to create positive change in companies, relationships, and communities.
Resources:
MRA's DEI Toolkit 
Jess's Website  
Jess's Book - Good Enough Now 
If you are interested in a complimentary copy of Jess Pettitt’s eBook, Good Enough Now, please email laura.kielbasa@mranet.org to get your code and details on how to download the book for free. There are a limited number of codes so don’t delay!
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Meet the Guest - Jess Pettitt 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Jess Pettitt 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:51:05UnknownNow it's time to thrive. Well, hello everybody, and welcome to this episode of 30 Minute THRIVE Thank you for joining us today. I am so excited for our conversation today because you get to hear from a very talented and experienced individual. Jess Pettit suggests a top facilitator and educator in the diversity and inclusion space. She spent the last 20 years teaching, motivating and entertaining more than half a million people just in North America alone.
00:00:51:07 - 00:01:17:16UnknownAnd speaking of that, Jess is actually one of our keynote speakers at MRA's 2023 DEI conference this year. So, Jess, I know your main goal is to kind of start that conversation while also ensuring that people feel at ease and really feel safe to learn and ask these questions. And I. So for our episode today specifically, we're kind of going to delve into the world of good enough now.
00:01:17:16 - 00:01:42:10UnknownAnd that philosophy and really its impact on personal growth, its potential to create positive change in companies, relationships and communities. So before we dive into that topic, I'm really kind of curious to know just what got you started on your DEI journey. Well, first off, thank you for having me and what I get asked quite often like what got you started?
00:01:42:10 - 00:02:05:17UnknownAnd there's kind of two answers at the same time. The quickie answers are, number one. I was lucky enough to grow up in Texas with parents that were very curious. So any time I would ask a question, I was sent to the library to go find out all the different kinds of answers and then did presentations to my family on the fireplace about whatever it was.
00:02:05:19 - 00:02:31:09UnknownSo I think most of the questions I asked seemed to be kind of around what I think collectively we would refer to as the underdog or hypocrisy or things that just didn't make sense. And I wasn't raised in an environment where like, Nope, this is it. Don't ask any more questions. So I think that is a significant part of my curiosity.
00:02:31:11 - 00:02:55:13UnknownI think the other part is, is that when I had real jobs, I often was advocating. I worked, as I called an administrator. My first masters is in higher education Administration with an emphasis in crisis management. So I worked on college campuses, advocate ing for underrepresented students, and how the college or the university could better serve its surrounding community.
00:02:55:15 - 00:03:22:18UnknownAnd in doing that would often point out what the university was doing to impact the community in a negative way or how they were under serving students. So I would get fired, go to another one, get another job, get fired so I kept getting fired. And eventually I know it's in our conference, but high HR, I spent a lot of time with you, but mostly I got fired because I was advocating for something that the university didn't want to do differently.
00:03:22:20 - 00:03:51:19UnknownSpoiler alert. I would say that in my younger years, I didn't understand managing up and maybe would use like a different font in how I advocated, but I would do it all over again because I have just always attempted to advocate for those that didn't have a voice at the table. So here we are. Yeah, I love that and I love that you stayed curious and that's kind of helped you with your DD journey, and that's a big difference.
00:03:51:21 - 00:04:14:23UnknownSo just we mentioned that you're also the closing keynote speaker at our DEI conference this year, and your session is titled Good Enough Now. So can you kind of explain what is good enough now? Can you kind of share your thoughts on waiting to change versus taking that immediate action to kind of be the best version of ourselves?
00:04:15:00 - 00:04:43:13UnknownAbsolutely. I think that I should probably full disclosure, I'm a Virgo and a really anal retentive person, which means that I have perfectionist tendencies. Definitely have experienced some imposter syndrome in my life. And as I was listening to my audiences, to be frank, I was kind of burning out on talking about vocabulary and approaching diversity and kind of this way, old way, that I used to do it.
00:04:43:15 - 00:05:13:08UnknownAnd I was burning out because I wasn't noticing a lot of progress. And then being a perfectionist, if you can't solve this problem, then it's very un motivating. And in my kind of sinking burnout stage, I started listening to my audiences in a different way and I kept finding them coming up with a reason or an excuse to not engage in a conversation or to not truly go and start something or do something.
00:05:13:08 - 00:05:36:19UnknownOr they wanted to. There was a want there, but they they couldn't like just go because they didn't feel adequately prepared. They were waiting for all the correct variables to be in place. And I realized that kind of the intersection of what I would call my burnout because of perfectionism, there was this You need to do it anyway.
00:05:36:21 - 00:06:06:12UnknownAnd if we're waiting to solve this problem, wouldn't you think somebody amazing ahead of us would have already solved it? And the I think it's an excuse is to wait until you have it perfect, because we feel entitled to the success or feel entitled to winning. So when I kind of noticed this as my own cure to keep me in this work, I realized in my kind of mantra is, do the best you can with what you've got.
00:06:06:14 - 00:06:36:16UnknownSome of the time, frankly, because it's better than nothing. Never. And obviously, this does not apply to, like, surgery or things where accuracy is really important. So talking about advocating for someone trying can be frankly, trying. It can be exhausting. But when you don't know how to start trying, what you end up doing is you start trying to try and ultimately trying to try is good enough place to start, right?
00:06:36:18 - 00:06:59:14UnknownI feel like it's all about kind of just taking that first step. And I know a lot of perfectionists out there who probably appreciate this, this kind of concept, but how do you personally relate to the concept of feeling that imbalance between who you are and kind of like what you mentioned, who you think you should be, where you think you should be in the context of DIY?
00:06:59:22 - 00:07:20:15UnknownI think what's at the root of diversity, equity and inclusion is either kind of those of you not watching the video have two hands up, right? So one of them is recognizing all of the pain and suffering that you have experienced in your life, has made you who and how you are in the world. And that is a really important thing to acknowledge.
00:07:20:17 - 00:07:47:17UnknownThere are also a lot of privileges that have made you who and how you are. And most of us kind of enter this advocacy or DIY work because of our resilience or our survival, which includes like code switching at work, doing things that you need to do to hide certain parts of you or cover certain lived experiences or identities, you have to navigate the workplace.
00:07:47:19 - 00:08:27:01UnknownI totally get that. I understand from my subordinated or marginalized identities, the organization that I've done to stay alive or to thrive is very personal to me. I totally get that. However, if we were to enter from our privileged identities, there's no risk. It's not about thriving. It's about just trying to do the right thing. So I try to really inspire her, myself and others to enter these conversations from their dominant or privileged identities, because that's the place where we have all the tools and the resources to actually do something, even if we can't do it perfectly.
00:08:27:03 - 00:08:50:19UnknownAnd we might not actually notice when we're doing the right thing because it's the right thing in the right way, regardless of how our life has taught us how to be. I try to role model that I tried in my book. I try to like create a pathway for people to gain their own self-awareness of what it is they could be doing and encourage people to try to do just that.
00:08:50:21 - 00:09:39:05UnknownAbsolutely. Or I feel like sometimes taking these steps may kind of produce some challenges. So what are some kind of common challenges that you've seen people face when striving for better relationships, bettering themselves, fulfillment, stronger teamwork in the realm of DEI? I mean, I think the answer is in good enough, people don't feel good enough, and also at times have experienced what it does feel like to be good enough and that they're actually the same feeling, right, is like, I'm kind of sucks, but I guess I can give this a whirl of even if it's something outside of a DEI context, you're driving around and you get a flat tire.
00:09:39:07 - 00:09:58:24UnknownI don't know about you, but I don't consider myself a flat tire handler expert. Right. So then there's this kind of incompetence moment where you're like, I don't wait, what do I do? And then, like, every tick tock you've ever seen comes, like, flashing back to you, and all of a sudden you're, like, lug nuts. That's a word I haven't used in forever.
00:09:59:13 - 00:10:19:07Unknownlug nuts. I need one of them sticky things to get the lug nuts off while you're fumbling around in the trunk of your car looking for the. Is it a crowbar? Is it a jack? I don't know. The key things that you do, the lug nut twisty bit This, like a little kernel of information, comes where you're like, Do it in a star.
00:10:19:09 - 00:10:43:02UnknownWhere did that come from? I don't know, But you undo it in a start. Now, all of a sudden, you know, this. That methodology, you're. It's okay. It's good enough information at the time because you're in a pickle. You got a flat tire. You got to figure it out. When we start interacting with other people, even when we call it DIY work, most of us think we're only doing DEI work at work.
00:10:43:04 - 00:11:10:07UnknownSo then we clock out of work and we're at a grocery store. We're not employing those same skills. And what I'm here to talk about is not new skill development, but it's really recognizing when you choose not to use them, right? I mean, you do choose to use them because it's good enough to try. The other thing I would say is this is a little bit more of a longer answer, but often when we think of challenges, we think of challenges outside of ourself.
00:11:10:09 - 00:11:34:17UnknownAnd my challenge to everyone is to think of the challenges inside yourself. And when you are most challenged or most confronted, how are you showing up and how do you expect other people to show up? And you can actually adjust how you show up instead of waiting for other people to show up differently? So this is the I'll talk about this in the keynote.
00:11:34:17 - 00:11:57:15UnknownThis is the head heart action model. And once you can figure out kind of where you lean particular lean when you're challenged or feeling confronted or trying to decide to use the skills you currently have or to like take them off ramp, it'll be really helpful for you to know that I believe our lives have taught us who and how to be, and there's nothing wrong with that.
00:11:57:20 - 00:12:32:05UnknownWe just we're responsible for this kind of like net zero of how we begin a conversation. So we've got a lot of self-reflection to do after this podcast. It seems like hopefully. Well, you've kind of embraced and highlighted just kind of being your authentic self and how contributing that authenticity really kind of helps the effort. So in your experience, how does the authentic self contribute to these efforts and initiatives?
00:12:32:07 - 00:12:57:17UnknownIt's your base level foundation. I think everyone in this maybe this goes back to even perfectionism, but I think everyone knows how they are supposed to ought to be right. Like you're supposed to show up this particular way, but you're you're responsible for knowing how you're actually showing up and then citing taking ownership of the gap between the two.
00:12:57:19 - 00:13:26:24UnknownAnd do you want to be showing up in a different way or do you not want to? Like we often talk about and I call this an Instagram fight, but of giving grace to other people. And we don't necessarily know what that means, but we also don't even give grace to our self. And so but I think giving grace means is that person, whoever you're thinking of that's annoying their life taught them that that's the way to show up.
00:13:27:01 - 00:13:49:11UnknownSimilarly, your life taught you that this is the way to show up. Neither one guarantees that you're accurate or correct, but you did learn this in your life. And do you want to keep that learning or do you need to upgrade? That's great. So we've talked a lot of it, just a lot about the good enough now philosophy.
00:13:49:14 - 00:14:17:17UnknownBut do you have any examples or just any real life stories on how individuals or organizations have applied this philosophy to enhance their DEI initiatives or existing strategy? A little bit. I think that I'm working on a new book right now, and I have a case study sampling that y'all are welcome to download. Look, give me feedback, give me your ideas, etc..
00:14:17:19 - 00:14:39:16UnknownBut I think what's interesting is, is there's not a lot of room for failure. And if there is failure, we want to fix it as quickly as possible. But I think failure is a way of looking at a step in the right direction that didn't quite make it right. And so my new book is called Almost or It's Almost finished.
00:14:39:18 - 00:15:06:01UnknownBut it takes the Good Enough Now principles and applies it to an organization instead of your own individual sense of life or decision making. But on an organizational level, I track 56 different case studies of my own clients where something was attempted and it didn't quite work. And my premise is that it didn't quite work because it didn't use the full model.
00:15:06:01 - 00:15:32:06UnknownIt only kind of enters in one place. The tagline is when the answers need to ask more questions and there's a lot of quote unquote best practices within DEI that are not necessarily successful, but it's kind of what everybody does. And so what else could we do to flush out one of these initiatives or programing ideas or response ideas or diversity statements or whatever?
00:15:32:08 - 00:15:54:13UnknownCan we flush it out in a way that's paying attention in this three sided model so that it's set up for success instead of just being a reactionary response? And I find that to be probably the most debilitating thing that I work with, with organizations when I do consulting work is back in 1984, they tried something and it didn't work.
00:15:54:15 - 00:16:26:06UnknownAnd so then we're done. We just don't. We already did it. Or maybe they did something and it didn't work that one time. But there's still pain and suffering happening. And if we're talking about diversity, equity, inclusion, and we keep adding more letters, now we're adding belonging. The reason why we have to add more letters is it's not working because we haven't actually dismantled the systems inside of our workplaces to actually include everyone who is there, everyone we serve along our entire value chain.
00:16:26:08 - 00:16:46:14UnknownAnd in order for those people to really weigh in to part of the office culture, they have to buy in. And in order to buy in, they have to feel like they belong and are valued. And that's the real work we need to be doing. Well, I'm looking forward to that book almost. And that'll be interesting to read those case studies, too.
00:16:46:14 - 00:17:12:10UnknownAnd we've included dresses, a number where you can text, ask any questions, give her feedback, and also her contact information. So do you want to get in touch with her about that book? We've got the resources for you. But kind of talking about this whole belonging, how does self-acceptance play into the whole journey of being the best version of oneself in the context of DEI?
00:17:12:12 - 00:17:39:01UnknownIt's a really tricky question, but it mostly resides in internal responsibility. And there is nobody who isn't a hot mess, right? And often when we engage in these conversations, we want to point fingers at somebody else who is a bigger hot mess than somebody else. But this is a weird suspension of gravity, not gravity. Don't suspend gravity. Suspension of grammar.
00:17:39:01 - 00:18:17:06UnknownWhat's so close? It's so close. But if, like, I'm pointing my finger at you because I think you are a mess, I'm somebody else's mess. Right. Somebody looks at me and is like, I don't know what is wrong with her, but if she'd clean up her act, then it would be much better. So if I actually were to do that and to become more self-aware, to be responsible for myself and quote unquote, clean up my act, whatever that means, I'm role modeling for other people how to do it, and forcing other people to realize that I've become more responsible for my behavior, not just when I'm at work, but when I am in a
00:18:17:06 - 00:18:38:08Unknowncar wreck or at the grocery store or talking to a stranger at some festival. I'm still responsible for everything I do, everything I say, and who and how I am when I show up. Yeah, that's a good point that these these ideas and these philosophies, they don't only apply when you're at work, they should apply all the time.
00:18:38:10 - 00:19:01:18UnknownBut so I think a lot of people are probably wondering, how can I improve immediately? And I know we always talk about the DEI journey, that it takes steps and sometimes it takes a lot of time in practice. But do you have any ideas on what can individuals take away right now that they can start making those positive changes kind of immediately in the DEI space?
00:19:01:20 - 00:19:28:16UnknownSure. So two answers again. So the first one is stop looking for the finish line. So like a lot of us think that once we get a certificate or enough different friends or have updated our vocabulary enough, we are then done. That's not how this works, right? This is a forever and always thing. So the the progress, is it becoming more natural and being able to think about what are your responses right.
00:19:28:16 - 00:19:51:22UnknownLike there's a gap between your knee jerk reaction or response and the actual response. And that moment in between is where responsibility and reflection come in. So that's when you're actually working. It is when you take time for that little second response instead of just your knee jerk reaction that's actually making progress, but it doesn't get you somewhere.
00:19:52:02 - 00:20:16:17UnknownIt helps you decide where you're going to get. So that's the first thing I would say. The other thing I would say is one of the links that you have is to a survey. And the survey will help you identify how you right now are showing up across difference or in conflict. And it's either going to be very detail oriented, very idea oriented, or I don't have time for any of that business.
00:20:16:17 - 00:20:38:18UnknownI just want to do something. And when you figure out how it is, you're showing up and you get a little bit more used to or comfortable with your own showing up habits, then it's a lot easier for you to adjust how you're showing up based on how other people showing up habits are happening. Those are the two immediate things let go of winning or finishing.
00:20:38:20 - 00:21:09:14UnknownAnd how are you right now? Because that's your responsibility kind of part two of this question. And I would just add, if you have anything to add on this. Any strategies or just basic practices that our listeners can adopt to align their personal growth with their DEI goals and values? The hardest one, and I'll talk very specifically about this in my keynote as well, but the hardest one is what I would call the 100% responsibility.
00:21:09:16 - 00:21:32:22UnknownI do not recommend trying to do this 100% of the time because it is exhausting. But notice when you're not doing it and when it's easier to do it. And what I mean is, is that before you say something, email, text, whatever, can you prepare yourself to be 100% responsible for whatever it is that's about to occur? Once you say text, send the thing.
00:21:32:24 - 00:21:55:09UnknownAnd a lot of people will say like, I'm only 50% responsible. But frankly, that's on marriage therapist type job security. And I'm going to ask you to take some time to be 100% responsible so that no matter what it is that comes back at you as anything, you're way less defensive about it because you had made a solid 100% responsible choice before doing something.
00:21:55:11 - 00:22:19:13UnknownJust try that every once in a while. Or like I like to say, do the best you can with what you've got. Some of the time it will be a life changing way of blending what you think is a diversity equity inclusion kind of mindset with your authentic self in every interaction you have with other people. That's a great mentality to have.
00:22:19:14 - 00:22:46:12UnknownI'm definitely going to try that out after this. Well, as we kind of wrap up here today, Jess, I know you've given a lot of great advice and actionable steps, but do you have any last kind of might drop moments on how leaders and listeners today can just take that take that step to create a more inclusive and equitable environment based on all the principles that you kind of listed out for us today.
00:22:46:14 - 00:23:10:04UnknownHonestly, the hardest thing for people to actually do, if I'm having a mic drop moment, is I double dog dare you to stay in touch. You would think that that'd be pretty easy. Like, she's accessible. I can text or any time I can, you know, connect with her on LinkedIn or whatever. But people don't do it because it's hard to hang in your own space.
00:23:10:06 - 00:23:38:07UnknownAnd what I would might drop a moment is who else is going to hang in your space if it's not you? So we have to stop looking at this as just something external to us and step into ourselves because no one else can do that. To do the best we can with what we've got. Some of the time, I mean, if you want to learn from other people's failures, notice external to you, read my studies, give me some feedback, see what your thoughts are.
00:23:38:13 - 00:24:03:10UnknownIf you want to stay in touch, feel free to connect on LinkedIn or text me the numbers. 2026704262. But the truth is you won't. Maybe you'll connect with me on LinkedIn, but then that's it. And we don't hang in our own space. And if you happen to notice that you are in your own space, do the survey again.
00:24:03:12 - 00:24:23:14UnknownGo do the survey again and find out how in that moment, how are you showing up? Is there a pattern of who and how you are? And then what is that like for other people witnessing or interacting with you? You can take responsibility for that. And I'm here to help you along the way. So I double dog dare you stay in touch.
00:24:23:16 - 00:24:48:05UnknownDo my job. Right. Well, Jess, I want to thank you so much for being on the podcast today. And thank you for sharing all that great content. I can definitely walk away with a lot of great, impactful, actionable steps into our listeners. If you liked our chat and topic today, I would just urge you to comment something new you learned today or anything that you'd like to add on to our conversation.
00:24:48:07 - 00:25:09:03UnknownDon't forget to share out this episode. Consider joining MRA if you aren't a member already. We have all the resources you need in the show notes, all including resources about us in our topic today. Otherwise, thank you so much for tuning in today and thanks again, Jess. We will see you all next week. And that wraps up our content for this episode.
00:25:09:04 - 00:25:27:11UnknownBe sure to reference the show notes where you can sign up to connect. For more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA's 30 minutes THRIVE so you don't miss out. Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

October Talent Report with Jim Morgan

Description: 🎙️ Tune in to our latest podcast episode on MRA's October Talent Report! Discover the insights you need to stay ahead in the dynamic world of business, with a special focus this month on "Building the Generational Bridge." Don't miss out on the latest trends and best practices that will elevate your talent management game!
Resources:
Talent Report+ Webinar Series 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - Jim Morgan 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Jim Morgan 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR, powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:22:21UnknownNow it's time to thrive.
00:00:23:00 - 00:00:40:14UnknownWelcome to this episode of 30 Minute Thrive. It is that time again to go over this month's Talent report with Jim Morgan, MRA's vice president of Workforce Strategies. So we'll dive into what he's been seeing this month in the world of business in October. Thanks for coming on the podcast. Always a pleasure to be here.
00:00:40:16 - 00:01:01:02UnknownAll right. So let's go over what you're seeing this month. Women have been coming back to the workforce in high quantity. So what's driving this? What's the deal with this? I think there's a couple of things going on. Obviously, women have always been in the workforce, but I think post-pandemic, what we're starting to see now is women are still the primary childcare provider.
00:01:01:02 - 00:01:18:19UnknownAnd so I think they may have been at home more or might have been in a profession that allow them to work from home more. And now everything is sort of leveled out. Again, everybody's trying to figure out, you know, exactly what they're going to do. But right now, we've got women in the workforce or at least looking for a job at 77.8%.
00:01:18:19 - 00:01:40:03UnknownThat's the highest it's ever been in the United States. So that is a as another opportunity, I think, for people, you know, to go find folks. And that totals 815,000 people this year. So in terms of companies that are trying to say, you know, where is the talent? What is going on? We are seeing a little bit of a shift in that women for a whole bunch of different reasons.
00:01:40:03 - 00:02:05:01UnknownBut I think primarily post-pandemic are coming back into the workforce and in larger numbers than they ever have before. So going into your talent thinking section, you highlighted what was found by the PDC Employer Benefits Perspective Survey on companies wanting their health plans to improve the employee experience overall and really meet the needs of diverse employees over four generations.
00:02:05:03 - 00:02:45:03UnknownSo where do these employee concerns really lie within benefits? There are a couple of things that that really stood out. One was this desire for digital health care. And you know, we never did telemedicine until the pandemic and actually found out that that was pretty effective for certain things. There are times when obviously you want to come and see your doctor, but the opportunity to use digital to use that type of technology, whether that's in telemedicine, whether that's apps on our phone, whether that's collecting our own biometrics, I mean, you have wristwatches now that can collect all kinds of different data for us.
00:02:45:05 - 00:03:07:13UnknownAnd then having your data available in such a way that it can move from care provider to care provider. And you will see my doctor and then I have to go see a pharmacist and maybe have to see a specialist that it's easy for the employee to say, Here's where my information is, you will get it. So the digitizing of a while that has been a big thing.
00:03:07:15 - 00:03:32:17UnknownThe second one was employers trying to look at what's the clinical value of whoever their provider is. So if I'm using ABC Health Care, how easy is it for me to get to a clinic? What's the cost for me to visit the clinic and what are their results? Do they have good outcomes from visiting the clinic? So companies being one a little bit more critical about what's the value of the investment here.
00:03:32:23 - 00:03:56:11UnknownAnd secondly, how easy is it, how convenient is it for our employees so that health care is not a half full for them? Yeah, it's something, you know, that they're easily able to do. They also are starting to look at what's being called diverse benefits. You know, are we unconsciously biased against certain types of benefits that maybe would be good for folks in obvious one is holidays?
00:03:56:17 - 00:04:22:02UnknownYou know, you may have a company that traditionally was you get Christmas. You know well, not everybody celebrates Christmas. And so moving to floating holidays to say, look, you've got two holidays to celebrate, whatever your beliefs might be or just whatever your interests are. If there are beliefs that you want to follow. So that accommodates. You know, almost everyone also starting to look at, you know, child care is something that's a bigger deal.
00:04:22:02 - 00:04:45:20UnknownIt's very expensive. How do we accommodate some of that financial planning? Some people had access to financial planning maybe more than others. And so how do we sort of level that playing field So all of our employees have that sort of opportunity. You know, and then lastly, I think looking at the workforce of the future flexible benefits, we'll talk about that a little bit later when we talk about generations.
00:04:45:22 - 00:05:11:13UnknownBut you want different things in Iowa for a whole bunch of reasons. Not just because you're cooler and more here than I am, but lifestyle. Yeah, it isn't that I'm looking for right now. So being flexible with what our parents or what our employees are looking for and then on the recognition side, really starting to hear more of from companies about how much their employees value, whether it's being recognized for birthdays and anniversaries is for jobs.
00:05:11:13 - 00:05:31:22UnknownWell done from project to completed the swag, the lunches, all that stuff matters to people, and it actually matters again to the younger generations for sort of this sense of belonging. So we're seeing more. How do we prepare for that next generation? How do we make sure we're offering the things that they truly want? Looks like each hours got a lot of work out there.
00:05:31:24 - 00:05:53:14UnknownAnd they do. They always do it. Just keep getting more. Yeah. Well, let's talk about some other recent survey results. What were some of your findings this month in terms of C-suite happenings? What are they currently focusing on right now? Yeah, we looked at the Fortune Deloitte CEOs survey just to see kind of what's going on. And then we've done our own survey data on the Fortune Deloitte one.
00:05:53:14 - 00:06:17:12UnknownOne of the interesting things was for the first time in few years now talent was displayed by geopolitics and that was the number one concern and is been talent for as long as we can remember. But just the things that are going on around the world, whether that's in Israel, whether that's Ukraine and Russia, there's just a lot of things up in the air.
00:06:17:12 - 00:06:40:00UnknownThere's a lot of disruption and that has caught the attention of the CEOs in looking at their outlook for things. About half of the people in their survey said they think there's a recession coming within the next year. This recession has kind of been six months away for two years now. And I think everyone's waiting again for that other shoe to drop.
00:06:40:02 - 00:07:03:23UnknownAnd we keep thinking, well, that might have been it and that might have been it. And yet it doesn't quite happen yet. And within our own surveys here at MRA, it was amazing the number of companies that were budgeting from better times next year, but thinking the economy as a whole was still headed for a recession. So that dichotomy is really interesting that my company is going to do okay, but the economy is not.
00:07:04:00 - 00:07:27:20UnknownAnd I don't know if that's an upper Midwest thing. We have a kind of a talent shortage here still, and so if people are working, you know, I'm looking like must be good out there. Yeah. But they still think overall that there's this potential of a recession on the horizon. And then lastly, the whole technology area, technology in general in terms of how do we use it for efficiency?
00:07:28:00 - 00:07:49:11UnknownHow do we use it maybe for automation in manufacturing? How do we use it for better processes and moving things along quicker? And then, you know, the big monster on the block right now, artificial intelligence. What does that mean for us and companies now scrambling to put together what's our policy in artificial intelligence? How do we make sure our employees know what it is?
00:07:49:16 - 00:08:05:11UnknownHow do we use it for good and not for evil? And that's causing again, you know, I think HR, because a lot of times are the keepers of this type of policy on the forefront to say, how are we going to build this? We have people that are already using it, people who probably still don't know what it is.
00:08:05:17 - 00:08:28:14UnknownAnd we've got to kind of give them the guideposts that say this is where it can be used, this is how we think our company can benefit from this. Here are the cautions and making sure that everybody sort of up to speed on what's going on. Yeah, absolutely. And I guess now's a great time to plug. We do have an upcoming podcast on HR technology and using kind of the new innovations in AI and in HR.
00:08:28:15 - 00:08:52:23UnknownSo stay tuned for that. And then great timing on your part, because it's really companies trying to figure out a AI does these wonderful things, but it's got its own biases and occasionally it hallucinates in terms of creating its own information. So I think, you know, just the smart money is on. Use it for things to get you started, but you still got to take a look and you got to know where it came from.
00:08:52:23 - 00:09:11:01UnknownYou've got to sort of has to make sure it's accurate. And I think a lot of HR departments are looking at it. And I would say what where is a good place to use this and where should we not? Yeah, absolutely. And we're also talking about technology outside of AI because all eyes are on AI right now, but it's like, what else do we need to be aware of right now?
00:09:11:01 - 00:09:34:20UnknownSo that'll be a good one. Yeah, but kind of moving on from your from the field section, you lost some key factors that U.S. workers consider when considering a company for employment. So what did you find with like what were some of those factors. Yeah, this was some of this was from Eagle Hill Consulting and they were looking at Gen Z and millennials primarily to say, you know what matters to them.
00:09:34:24 - 00:09:58:09UnknownYeah. D y is big with these two groups bigger than their predecessors. it came up as a key factor in 77% of the Gen Z folks, 63% for millennials. They grew up in a different world. They're more culturally, I think, aware of what's going on. They grew up in a more diverse society certainly than I did. And so that's important to them.
00:09:58:09 - 00:10:28:03UnknownAnd they're seeing it in their everyday life. They see it in the workplace as well with those groups. Again, things that matter to them around collaboration, safety, a sense of belonging, culture, employee resource groups, all of those are designed really around making them feel at home in their workplace and that matters to them. And so companies really are taking a hard look at how do we make them feel comfortable here, how do we make them want to be here?
00:10:28:03 - 00:10:47:07UnknownThat's sort of the work life balance and the remote work that they're looking at, try to making their workplace attractive place to be, whether that's let's make it look like a Starbucks and people want to come in or let's make it look like there are things going on here that are really of interest. So it's not even a decision whether you want to stay home or go to work.
00:10:47:09 - 00:11:07:13UnknownI kind of want to go in there and see what's going on and still have that option of remote work. So how do we make people feel comfortable? How do we make them feel? Part of the team is really where they're spending an awful lot of their time. Yeah, absolutely. Well, kind of continuing that generational conversation. I know this month you featured the topic on building the generational bridge.
00:11:07:13 - 00:11:28:01UnknownSo do you have any kind of key points that you can summarize from that presentation or conversation in the teller part? Yeah. And where this one came from, as were a couple of years away from the generational tipping points, for lack of a better set of words. That's when the Gen Z and the Millennials will outnumber the baby boomers and the Gen Xers.
00:11:28:01 - 00:11:50:02UnknownAnd, you know, obviously this always happens one generation that's older and moves out and a new one comes in. But I think the characteristics of the two younger generations around technology, cultures, society is just very different than the two that are, you know, the actors and the boomers. And so I think that does make a difference. And companies are now having to pay a little bit more attention to that, to say, you know, what does that mean?
00:11:50:02 - 00:12:10:10UnknownAnd the couple of examples that we talked about on the talent report were, you know, what? What do you value? So if I think about it from a benefits point of view, and again, going back to what we were just talking about, you may be thinking, you know, I've got some student loan debt, I would like some help in paying back that it doesn't really matter to me all that much, but I am closer to retirement.
00:12:10:10 - 00:12:29:07UnknownSo how much money do I have in my 401k? I'm neither one of us. Probably. Health care may not be the biggest deal for us. You could still be on your parents for a couple of more years. I don't have three kids running around that are in their accident years. Yeah. So I'm looking for a different health care plan than I would have been ten years ago.
00:12:29:09 - 00:12:49:04UnknownAnd so how do we get in touch with what our folks are looking for? Because the benefits are a big deal. And I've said it before, it's not a benefit unless I think they benefit. And so if right now Netflix is of great value to you and maybe to everybody across every generation, they I want a screen, I want a streaming service that's a relatively cheap benefit.
00:12:49:04 - 00:13:10:06UnknownAnd if people really value that, well, good for us. And what are we offering that? You know, it no one's taking advantage of that and we're paying good money for that. Maybe we should reevaluate. So I think there's a real emphasis right now for companies to really know what's important to their employees. You know, try to be a little bit more flexible in their benefits and then providing the things that really matter to them.
00:13:10:08 - 00:13:38:05UnknownSo I think benefits is a big one. And I think there are big differences with different generational groups. We've got up. Yeah, cross generational teams we spent an awful lot of time on and companies kind joyously trying to say, you know what, if you and I are on the same team, we're going to bring very different perspectives then if it's by people who look like me or find people who look like you and I can quickly stereotype, okay, well, I've got more experience.
00:13:38:09 - 00:13:56:05UnknownI've probably seen more things. We've tried these different things. I know what worked and what didn't work. And so I can bring that, you know, you can bring a whole new perspective. You can bring probably some technology that I've never heard of. I might say we tried to do that before, and you'll be in a position to say, Yeah, but did you try it this way?
00:13:56:05 - 00:14:16:16UnknownYeah. And so the benefits of bringing together different groups of people, one, it's a great way to build a team within the organization. It breaks down some stereotypes, and the more that I get to know you, the smarter I see you are done. Sort of. yeah. 23 year old kid think she knows everything. Well, she does know stuff.
00:14:16:21 - 00:14:40:06UnknownAnd by working with you, that's how I begin to find that out. And you can look at me like, God, this guy's a dinosaur. He'll never brand a new idea to the table. And you might find out, No, I've got a couple. So there are benefits to that. Then there's the managing of it and how we look at work, when we work, how we work, you know, making sure, you know, the team members that I might like to I don't know.
00:14:40:06 - 00:14:57:08UnknownI need to be out by 3:00 on Wednesdays because I've got some group I go to. Yeah, you are a big biker in Friday afternoon to your biking tag. You know, little things like that. They just say, okay, let me know my people and they know the best time to maybe get this group of diverse interests together. Yeah.
00:14:57:10 - 00:15:24:22UnknownAnd then, you know, I think looking out for the potential roadblocks, though. Yep, we've got stereotypes. We've got to break through some of those things. The challenges of biases that are out there. Communications might be different, the technology might be different. So how are we going to communicate with each other? But then in the end, you know, we do start seeing using the even reverse mentoring to say, what can I learn from selfie?
00:15:24:24 - 00:15:51:20UnknownAnd that's not a way that you really if the two of us showed up, you could ask the vast majority, okay, who's was mentoring who Traditionally, it'd be okay. I'll mentor Sophie. What does Sophie have for me? How can Sophie help me better understand social media so I can better promote some of the things that I'm doing? What has Sophie learned as a more recent graduate from college of how people are using some of the things, different leads that I might be working with every day?
00:15:51:22 - 00:16:17:01UnknownHow can she teach me how to use Tik-tok to promote my videos? And you know, the speeches? I'm so, you know, two ways. I'm happy to share what I know, but I have to be open then to learning a little bit more about, you know, what it is that you know. So I think it was really talking about all the different things that we bring to the table and how do you get those generations to utilize the skills that each one's got.
00:16:17:03 - 00:16:39:07UnknownIt's issue that is all this time. Yeah, but I think it's even bigger now and we've got more opportunities. That bridge is a big one to cross, right? Yeah, absolutely. Well, I hope I can be a reverse mentor for you. Jenny Patrick, you play well, and I have to bring up your quote to your quarter of the month as it relates to this times of rapid technological or social change divide generations.
00:16:39:11 - 00:16:58:09UnknownRight now we have both. So can you explain why you chose this quote for this month? If you take the technology part out of it? Let me just start with the social part. If you think of the last few generations, you know, my grandparents race was pretty much segregated. And with my parents, they started to see some of the integration.
00:16:58:09 - 00:17:26:12UnknownThere was women's rights, there were people of color's rights. Then my generation, there were protests and yours early on, assassinations. And it was very, very much turmoil. And then you start moving into generations that are growing up together. We have different social issues now. We have Black Lives Matter. So, you know, things just keep changing. And that social world, as we evolve and hopefully try to get better, then you throw in the technology besides that.
00:17:26:12 - 00:17:47:21UnknownAnd that's the part I think, that had never been there. Social really changes the way we do things and now technology in the last two generations and even just the last generation, it changed everything the way that we communicate, the way that we go out and see people. You throw a pandemic in there. We all learned how to do zoom and video and everything else.
00:17:47:23 - 00:18:17:24UnknownAnd you combine those two things and all of a sudden people have access to all this information. They have the ability to communicate in 100 different ways. And you have all of these social issues at play. It really is another it's another place where it can either divide us or bring us together. And so I can either have my views on social issues and yours are a couple of generations later, and I have my ability to manipulate technology and year to generation and later you can see how that would Thrive things know further apart.
00:18:18:01 - 00:18:35:15UnknownAnd so that was I've heard that on a webinar and I just thought, you know, when you put those things together, that has the potential to really separate everybody or, you know, if you did forget it as a chance to bring us together, how do you manage both at the same time? Because I view it well this month in charts, you included some data around memories.
00:18:35:15 - 00:18:56:17Unknown2023 compensate in turn survey in webinar as well as data from Memories 2020 through National ID and Engineering survey. So can you explain what was shown in all of the charts and graphs that were on the talent report, like an hour long seminar, put it end to 2 minutes here for you. Go take a look at the Talent report if you have it, and then you'll understand.
00:18:56:19 - 00:19:16:09UnknownYou know, I would say, you know, the biggies were as everybody expected on this, the total overall compensation was a little about 4%. You know, for those who have filed this forever, it was 3%, 3%, maybe to nine, maybe three one. Last year. We went over for this year, you know, over for I'm guessing next year will probably be close to four.
00:19:16:09 - 00:19:42:00UnknownBut I think it might settle down a little bit. But over 4% was sort of the comp trend for the general population. The engineering was a little bit higher at engineering and industrial, you know, high level. Those folks are getting harder and harder to come by. And so that drove that a little bit. Probably. We spent the most time talking about pay transparency, that being Thriven by a couple of things.
00:19:42:00 - 00:20:09:07UnknownOne, younger generations that are a little more open with their pay and their benefits. You know, they find I am going to make $62,000 and next thing you know, it's posted on four different social media platforms and everybody knows, whereas few generations ago it was like, don't tell anybody. Yeah. So that's happening. There's now some legislation that's out there that's starting to tell employers you need to release pay ranges or you need to, you know, be able to explain all that.
00:20:09:09 - 00:20:27:18UnknownSo we're not there right now by our own employers. Survey results that most of them are at a level where they hope their employees can understand how to read their paycheck and know what the deductions are. And we're quite a ways away from does everyone know their pay range? Do they know where they fall in it? Do they know your pay philosophy?
00:20:27:20 - 00:20:52:11UnknownAnd so how do companies move if there's the legislation continues to roll and it's out already in some states, some municipalities, cities and counties have put in place, how do you begin to explain compensation to the average employee so they understand your philosophy, They understand ranges because the first is that will be, if you tell me I'm at 90% of my rage, I'll be talking about I'm way better than average I should be.
00:20:52:11 - 00:21:12:22UnknownAnd I'm wondering 10% and trying to explain what the data is for compensation. So I think that's going to be a big one. And I think you're going to see more and more companies talking about pay transparency. Where are they going to fall in that? And keeping an eye on statehouses and federal issues to see what other legislation they pass in the future.
00:21:12:23 - 00:21:30:19UnknownAnd I actually know a friend who they're looking for a job and as they're scrolling through job openings, they won't even look at the jobs that don't list the salary or the salary range. So I guess, yeah, that is a big deal. And yeah, and then you get some of the services out that are out there. Some are much better than others.
00:21:30:19 - 00:21:48:10UnknownBut somebody in one of our roundtable said, Yeah, there was a job and the pay range was 50 to $300000. God, yes. All right. Well, where do I fall about to cover it, you know, So that's not a real helpful either. Yep. So you're going to be up against all the data that's out there, all the different organizations that are putting it out.
00:21:48:13 - 00:22:08:24UnknownSome are very good, are not so good. But as an employee now, one of the examples we used in comp trends was they can go into Chad GPT and go into some other artificial intelligence and say, I'm 42 years old, I have 15 years of experience, I have a degree in engineering, I'm in Shawano, Wisconsin, and I want to know how much money I should make.
00:22:09:01 - 00:22:29:04UnknownAnd it's going to give them an answer, whether it's good, bad or indifferent. But they're looking at it like, well, artificial intelligence told me i think they should make and they walk into HR And so now HR is up against artificial intelligence plus other people's survey results, plus people taking data from new york city and comparing it to shawano, wisconsin.
00:22:29:06 - 00:22:52:12UnknownSo that's just another area where the human resources people really after themselves be prepared with data and information and now have to start educating their hiring managers so they too can answer some of those questions when their staff members come to them. Right. For health. There's another thing on the plate, another saying, well, as we wrap up, we're always going to ask, can you give us a sneak peek on what November's talent report will be?
00:22:52:12 - 00:23:08:02UnknownThe topic? Yeah, we're going to talk about talent strategies. And I know we've talked about that a thousand times, but we're going to try to take a little bit different look at it and look out to the future a little bit and say, you know, what are innovative companies doing to attract and retain and what does the future of work look like a little bit?
00:23:08:02 - 00:23:28:24UnknownAnd so as companies, we're starting to make some adjustments in whether that's work life balance, remote work benefits, all that type of stuff. What are innovative companies doing to make sure that they're going to have the talent supply chain? Gotcha. Well, you heard them. You got to tune in for it. Well, Jim, thank you again for the recap on this month's talent report.
00:23:28:24 - 00:23:48:02UnknownI appreciate it. And to our listeners, if you liked our chat and you like the topic today, I would urge you to comment the most valuable piece of information that you learned today or any current trends or topics that you've been seeing this month in the HR world. Don't forget to share out the episode and consider joining MRA if you aren't a member already.
00:23:48:04 - 00:23:57:24UnknownWe have all the resources you need in the show Notes below, including resources on this Once Talent report. Otherwise, thank you for tuning in and we'll see you next week.
00:23:57:24 - 00:24:14:07UnknownAnd that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect for more podcasts updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA's 30 minutes Thrive so you don't miss out.
00:24:14:08 - 00:24:19:00UnknownThanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

Inbox Intelligence: Choosing Email for Effective Business

Description: Unlock the art of strategic business communication in our latest episode, 'Inbox Intelligence.' Dive into the world of email correspondence and discover when and why it's your most powerful tool. Explore effective practices, enhance your professional connections, and master the finesse of choosing email for impactful business interactions. If you're looking to harness the potential of email for impactful interactions, this episode of 'Inbox Intelligence' is a must-listen.
Resources:
Effectively Using Email in the Workplace Video 
Business Email - Write it Right Course 
Business Writing for Impact: How to Write So People Will Read Course
Overcoming Inbox Overwhelm: Streamline Your Processes Course 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - Andy Marris 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Andy Marris 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR, powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR. MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:48:22UnknownNow it's time to thrive. Well, hello everybody, and welcome to episode number 59 of 30 minute Thrive. Today we're going to dive into the world of email, specifically inbox intelligence and discover when and why it's your most powerful tool. So today I'm joined with expert Andy Marris, MRA learning and development instructor, as he runs through his tips and tricks on using email in our professional lives.
00:00:48:24 - 00:01:14:14UnknownSo thanks for being here today to be here with you. Okay, so let's start out with the positives. Andy, what are the key advantages of using email as a form of business communication and in today's digital landscape? Well, email is really fast. You can reach a mass audience very quickly and it's documented forever. It's a great follow up tool at a conversation or a meeting so that we talked about this before, right?
00:01:14:15 - 00:01:38:15UnknownPeople know what to do when. But it's also a great way to inform people of things that are easy to understand. Right? If it's confusing, though, I wouldn't put it in email. And then, of course, it's a great documentation tool. So now let's flip that question. What are the biggest challenges of email? It's really fast. You can reach a mass audience really quickly and it's documented forever.
00:01:38:16 - 00:01:57:03UnknownLiterally, the pros are also the cons because once you hit send, yeah, that's gone. But anything that's real complex or difficult to understand, that's just going to make it a difficult concept and then they're going to not get it. You can't watch somebody react. You can't read their body language and if they get it or not, you can read that in someone's face when we're looking at them.
00:01:57:03 - 00:02:20:24UnknownYou can't get that out of an email. And it is a big one when you're emotional. Right. Be very careful to take a break, get yourself collected and cool, because if you type in your emotional, it's going to come way worse on the other end than even you intend. Sometimes you got to, you know, go take a walk, yell at the trees, whatever you got to do, take a deep breath.
00:02:21:01 - 00:02:40:08UnknownBut you want to make sure you're careful with those emotional emails because it comes off the way worse than you than you originally intended. And then anything that's not for public consumption or confidential, as we said, email is never gone. Yes. Great point. In addition to that, tone is really difficult to read. You know what? What a cliché.
00:02:40:08 - 00:02:55:18UnknownI'm using my mother in law as an example, but when she says I'm fine, she's fine. When she says I'm fine, I don't know what I'm going to find out later, but it's going to be a while. Yes. Before she reveals that, Right. Well, you can hear that in someone's tone. You can't read it very well in an email.
00:02:55:20 - 00:03:26:12UnknownAnd so that's also a problem. And then even the mechanics. I had a woman I worked with years ago who had a she was really into grammar to be in the grammar police, and she had a really funny sign on her desk that said, I'm silently judging your grammar in my head, and these make me chuckle. But even something as silly as, you know, using a colon instead of a semicolon or a comma after your greeting, that's supposed to be the business way to do it.
00:03:26:12 - 00:03:45:22UnknownI couldn't care less. I'm not the grammar police. But you know, something that like that simple could set your email sideways. And then also the design really matters. We've probably all seen somebody as a very stylized background, and because of it, it's really hard to read. Sometimes you please a whole block of text and it just, yeah, your eye doesn't know where to stop.
00:03:45:24 - 00:04:05:14UnknownAnd so there's lots of things that can go wrong with it, even though it's a wonderful tool and use. Well, yes, I'm like picturing now the worst emails I've ever gotten or written, but I feel like I all I'm like an emoji person. So in my emails I will always add an emoji to help with tone so that they know like, Hey, I'm not meaning this in a bad way.
00:04:05:14 - 00:04:29:24UnknownAnd that's good. Emoticons are invented for then. Is it a smart alec smiley face or a happy smiley face? And how professional is that? Right? So you've got to know your audience when you're sending that out. Yeah, but that is the purpose, right? To add tone to text. And that's, that's not soft serve. Sophie So what examples do you have on when tone was maybe misinterpreted with email?
00:04:30:01 - 00:04:49:03UnknownI've got a funny one from several years ago. I had a participant in one of my classes and we were talking about how difficult tone is to read. And I was in in Chicago, and I remember as we're discussing that she kind of starts laughing and she says, Well, I've got kind of an embarrassing one that just happened to me.
00:04:49:03 - 00:05:08:19UnknownAnd I said, Well, you comfortable sharing? And she said, Sure. And she said, And folks, this is not necessarily the people at your company. But she said, my my I.T. guy is kind of the stereotype on Saturday Night Live or makes me feel bad for doing his job because over in like, click, click, click. It really? Yeah. Did you even plug it in that guy?
00:05:08:19 - 00:05:27:20UnknownRight. So she's like you. It's alter the computer kind of thing. That was her relationship with him. And so there was a vulnerability. There was a virus going around, and he wanted to save some time. And this was many years ago. And I remember when I was in the IT industry years ago, these are called the sneaker netting because the I.T.
00:05:27:20 - 00:05:41:10UnknownStaff would put their sneakers on and run from computer to computer. This is before I had all these things behind the wall. They could just fix it. Yeah, well, he sends out an email because he's going to try and get to each computer, but it's going to take them a while to get to everybody. So he sends out an email.
00:05:41:10 - 00:05:57:04UnknownSo if they can install this patch to keep them from getting the virus, all the better if they can beat him to it. Right. So he sends out this this email and I'll quote unquote read it to you. It says, hello. There's been a huge virus going around the country. You want to we want to make sure we don't get it.
00:05:57:06 - 00:06:12:01UnknownHere are the steps to install the attachment. He did Remember to attach it, by the way. Yeah, that's always a new right here are the steps. And then in bullet points, which I love, right? I want it to be one pane of glass. Bullet point. Bullet point. Bullet point. Bullet point. All of the directions on how to do it.
00:06:12:03 - 00:06:33:08UnknownThank you, Jim. It said please. It said thank you. Should they sprinkle in a little tone? She was so angry after reading that she went running to H.R.. Look what I have to put up with from this jerk. She had it in her hand as she printed it out. Any. Any idea why? It's pretty funny when she realized what had happened.
00:06:33:14 - 00:06:55:15UnknownI don't know why, Because, you know, the human resources, the person's looking at the thing and go, What's wrong with it? It's very technical. There's nothing emotional about it. And she read it and she read it. I'll give you a hint. It was just one word. It was at the very beginning. Do you remember how that email started?
00:06:55:17 - 00:07:16:03UnknownHello? Yeah, hello. It's a greeting. Right? So a feeling. Hello. How are you? What's wrong with that? Well, can you think of any other interpretations of Hello? Maybe you've seen the movie Back to the Future. I guess. Hello, McFly. Buddy Holly. She read the entire email as if he was knocking on her head like she was an idiot.
00:07:16:03 - 00:07:35:16UnknownOh, wow. And it wasn't based on one word. Based on one word. We read tone into our messaging, and that's what we're up against. I think it's scary. I also think it's a very funny story that is fun. But wow, right? This is what we're up against. And that's why your idea about the emoticons or any of the emojis.
00:07:35:16 - 00:07:54:24UnknownYeah, that's why we use them. Maybe he needed to add a smiley face. Yeah, I don't know. And then she might have thought as a smart aleck smiley face. So who knows where that would have gone, but. Well, that's what we're up against. So good story. So are there certain situations then we're using email might hinder rather than enhance business communication?
00:07:55:01 - 00:08:11:15UnknownYeah. If anything has to be confidential, don't put it in an email. There is no such thing as a confidential email. Which is funny because there's even a little button you can push that says confidential. It's not defensible in court at all, and anyone in the world who has an email address can have that sent to them. Exactly.
00:08:11:21 - 00:08:33:22UnknownWe've seen so many examples over the years of people getting in trouble because of email be in ink. It's found even if you you know, there's been stories of people using software like bleach bit to get rid of emails and sure that got it off your server and in your computer, but it's still on the server or the network or the computer, the people you sent it to or the people you sent it to, who sent it to somebody else.
00:08:33:24 - 00:08:54:09UnknownAnd so it really has no no end in mind digging the one forever as long as somebody has an email address. So that is kind of frightening. Don't put it in email if you wouldn't want anybody to read it outside of, you know, normal conversation. It's kind of like the tree falling in the woods, you know, nobody hears it.
00:08:54:09 - 00:09:26:03UnknownDid it really make a noise? Well, everybody here's an email because it can be forward to any anyone that has an email address. I also run into different relationship things, right? So once you hit send, as I said, they can change the relationship forever. And so we see people using false urgencies, urgent and exclamation point and red and all caps and all those things can really set people off if it's too long on one hand, too wordy, and then if it's too abrupt, not wordy enough.
00:09:26:05 - 00:09:46:22UnknownIt's funny how this really can have a lot of problems in typing an email when we're emotional. Really, that can really cause problems because tone is so hard to read. Yeah, it comes off way worse than even we were anticipating. And if we're heated when we write it, it comes off isn't serious. Yeah. Going back to your that emails are not confidential.
00:09:46:24 - 00:10:11:08UnknownIt's kind of like social media to whatever you put on social media. Don't expect it there forever. Yeah, exactly. It's going to be there forever. It lives forever. But we talked about some of these challenges. How can you overcome them? It's a good question. One of the things we had that podcast, a few podcasts ago, we talked about meetings and I talked about can this meeting be an email if it's something really simple and easy to understand?
00:10:11:10 - 00:10:37:12UnknownWell, you can ask the opposite question Should this email be a meeting? Yes. If it's more complex, we better do that right. Emails for simple concepts or to follow up is when it's best, right? So we use. I learned this from my colleague Janet. I love this. She calls it the grandma or judge rule. If you're going to make grandma blush by what's in there or you got to stand in front of a judge, don't put it in an email.
00:10:37:14 - 00:11:00:04UnknownAnd so I think that's that's something to really remember when you're considering what you're what you're hitting send. Yeah, absolutely. Any other scenarios where you should not definitely send an email or I know we talk about here if if you're writing and writing and writing and you can't just quickly send it, you should just pick up the phone and call that person.
00:11:00:06 - 00:11:16:18UnknownYeah. If you have to explain something, it's so much easier just going in person or picking up the phone. I like to call that the three thread rule that if I've sent it, they've replied, I've sent another one. It goes back three times, pick up the clock, pick up the phone and call them if you can see them.
00:11:16:18 - 00:11:41:03UnknownEven better yet, go see them face to face. You're just going to pile on the confusion. Yeah, the lack of clarity. The more you try to explain something email, if it's not, if it's not understood. I think everyone here in who's listening can agree that we simply get way too many emails, though. Sure. And that means that a lot of emails can also be missed too, because our inbox is so big.
00:11:41:05 - 00:12:04:06UnknownSo how can you make your message stand out among the mass amount of emails that we already get? Lots of lots of ways that really, really help. You really want to think of your readers perspective. You know, I tell this joke in class, it's lame. Sara I heard it before, but w I have them in the morning. It's what everyone is listening to.
00:12:04:07 - 00:12:25:22UnknownI do my radio voice there, but it really does. It is not a radio station. It's it's what's in it for me is what that stands for. And that joke doesn't work. West of the Mississippi, by the way, everything starts with K. But anyway, we want to put our our tone in our in our message, in their reading perspective right now.
00:12:25:24 - 00:12:43:21UnknownHow do I want to best send it? It you know it. You've got your message to your head. How will they best receive it so they can act? And so I haven't kind of put myself in their shoes. How does this make sense to them? Yeah. Is there a meaningful and searchable subject line? I encourage people actually to fill that out second to last.
00:12:43:23 - 00:13:00:24UnknownPeople usually type it right away. We'll talk about that in a little bit, but it's actually something that I prefer to do once I've written the whole thing. Because sometimes if I start out with any with a subject line in the email, I could change significantly by the time I've typed it in, by the time it hit send, maybe I need a new subject line any way.
00:13:00:24 - 00:13:20:24UnknownI think I want to make sure that it's searchable in case somebody is looking for that in the future. That's easy to find and it's not, you know, just to get their attention. You know what you'd see and you cry wolf because it really wasn't that important. Right. And there's that urgency thing again. Yeah. So that makes me think of like you customize your emails based on different people, too.
00:13:20:24 - 00:13:43:23UnknownSo I know some people who would just like, want one word in the subject line, No, open it. Or I know another person who would want like a detailed subject line. So it's like it's also funny thinking about the person who you're sending the email to, how it changes. Basically, there used to be people would use it like instant messenger before the thing and would say poem for end of message and everything was in the subject line.
00:13:44:00 - 00:14:04:13UnknownYeah, don't do that anymore. We moved on right now, but that was a thing years ago. One of the things I always suggest is to make sure your message as much as possible is on one pane of glass. And of course, you've got your your surface in the view pane of glass is about this big. What about cell phone?
00:14:04:13 - 00:14:22:13UnknownRight. Can can you get it so small that they don't have to endlessly scroll now that's not always possible. Yeah, you need to give them enough information that they can take action but the shorter the better. Yeah. And I even prefer if I can get away with it. Bullet points as opposed endless paragraphs. Right. They're going to scroll and scroll is probably not to get read.
00:14:22:13 - 00:14:48:16UnknownAbsolutely. Well, we talked about one. You should not send an email or use Email is the best form of communication. So do you have any specific scenarios where email is proven to be the superior choice for professional interactions? It's an awesome follow up tool. I love after a phone call or after a meeting or even a face to face conversation.
00:14:48:18 - 00:15:05:14UnknownHere's what we spoke about. Bullet point, bullet point, bullet point so that, you know, the person can take action and we can remember and it's documented, right, So that people can say, Well, you didn't say that or we didn't agree to do that. Well, here's what we agreed upon and that they disagree with it, then we can have that discussion over the follow up email.
00:15:05:14 - 00:15:29:17UnknownYeah, but I think it's a tremendous tool for that. I love that. It is great when you reach a mass audience. Yeah. And so we can do that really quickly, really efficiently. Just be just be really sure that it's ready to go before you hit. Send in with like follow ups. Like you said, the meetings, you can include resources than in the mail to Great idea.
00:15:29:19 - 00:15:55:17UnknownGreat. Are you one of my favorite things with helping people tailor an email message is to help them understand that if you know the communication style of the person you're emailing that can really help you. Folks that are very analytical want lots and lots of information, folks that are what are often called Thrivers or dominant communication styles. They want it as short as possible, right?
00:15:55:19 - 00:16:15:01UnknownWell, how can you how can you make both happy, Right. If you're sending to a mass audience? Right. Well, what I suggest is you have it short, but then have a link is best if you can have a link or second passes an attachment. But you've got to make sure you remember to send it. Yeah, attach it right before you send.
00:16:15:03 - 00:16:33:18UnknownWe had that oops moment before, right. But then anyone that wants to swim in all that data and information can go to the attachment or go to the link. Yeah. And a person that couldn't care less doesn't have to read all that. Still gets what they need to be able to act on that email. And I think it's really important to remember business email should be actionable, right?
00:16:33:20 - 00:16:56:06UnknownIt's it's for accomplishing things and so there should be some action tied to it. It can be just to make something clear, to follow up, which I think is also a good tool, but usually following up on something that needs to be acted upon. Yeah, that's a great point. So how does email contribute to effective collaboration, especially when working with remote or international teams?
00:16:56:06 - 00:17:15:05UnknownIt's a great question, right? Follow up is so critical when you're in different time zones. I mean, it's critical even in the same building. Yeah, but it really helps us to make sure everybody is literally on the same page, is doing the right things at the right time by the due dates. Email makes that really easy and it can be asynchronous.
00:17:15:08 - 00:17:35:22UnknownSomebody could open it on the other side of the world and it's instantaneous, right? So that is a really great factor with it. You can add the little at symbol in somebody's name and then you can actually send it to several people, but actually have individual call outs where they have different action items they have to do. And so that can really use it.
00:17:35:22 - 00:17:53:00UnknownYou can use it that way as a collaboration tool and people can read it when it's most convenient to them, their timeframe, their time zone, Right? Yeah, I just kind of a funny little ad I try to tell people don't put. Good morning. Good evening. Good afternoon. Because you don't know when they're going to read it. It might be that time when you send it.
00:17:53:00 - 00:18:11:11UnknownIt's just a little awkward. It's not a big deal. But I want I want to make sure that that is your maybe has a greeting because I think that sprinkles in some tone. I like using people's name if I can, or my colleague Cheryl says it's the most beautiful sound to a person's ears. And I say, I say that the way they like to be, call it too.
00:18:11:11 - 00:18:29:13UnknownI. Mandy Somebody calls me Andrew. I think somebody is mad at me. So especially Bob Right. But, but yeah, I think that's how we sprinkle in a little tone because it is really hard to read. Yeah. And, and I think it's really considerate when they can read it when they're able to. Yeah. And the email allows for that in a clever way.
00:18:29:15 - 00:19:01:24UnknownSo how about then some of the other email etiquette rules that people may not know or just generally think of? Great question and there's no Emily Post Guide to email etiquette. There's nothing like that. Yeah, but I think most people will agree on a lot of these because they've just seen it abused so many times and they get irritated when they see this one thing, especially that you just mentioned about international, for example, I want to reflect the formality of my reader.
00:19:02:01 - 00:19:23:20UnknownIf it's a first time conversation or, you know, email read with somebody in another culture, I probably would start out with Hello, Miss Bowler or Hi Mrs. Bowler. And I'd Hey, Sophie. Right? It just it it's not as professional. But if they are, if they then reflect back a more casual tone, then I think that that's a good place to start.
00:19:23:22 - 00:19:44:05UnknownLimit those emoticons in those emojis that we talked about, you know, is it professional here? It's okay if you've got that type of relationship and they know you. But here's the biggest one for me as far as etiquette. We've got to watch out for that reply to all button. I am so tired of somebody saying we're ordering from cousin's subs.
00:19:44:05 - 00:20:06:12UnknownWhat do you want? And somebody replies to, Oh, I'll have the turkey with extra mail. I don't care. I didn't ask. Raised me up this way. So we reply to all and everybody needs to know. Well in there's like emails where people are like just reply to me and then it's like implied all Hi, I got to give some people some grace on this.
00:20:06:12 - 00:20:25:23UnknownI understand that there's certain phones that if people reply from their phone it automatically replies to all, Well then we should talk to that company and get them to fix that. But that's beside the point. So then assume good intent that they didn't mean to send that to everybody. But good gracious, I don't care about your turkey sandwich if I didn't have.
00:20:25:23 - 00:20:52:00UnknownI'm not taking the order. So now, looking ahead with the rise of AI in automation, how do you really first see the evolution of emails of role in in business overall? Yeah, that's a that's an that's an interesting one. Now, I think we're going to not know whether it's a human being there or of a AI writing us on one hand, but I think it'll be even easier to find what we're looking for.
00:20:52:02 - 00:21:13:18UnknownEven if somebody does a poor job in the subject line or the message, if you needed six months later, what did that person say? What do I need to know? I think that'll help us find those types of things. The it's still the Wild West. We're going to we're going to find out. But I think those things maybe could be some advantages in AI can help craft an email or help you create an email template.
00:21:13:18 - 00:21:42:10UnknownSo before we close out the episode, what is one more thing that you want listeners to remember about email? I mentioned a moment ago that we should fill out this subject line second to last writing. We don't really know what the message is going to say until we typed it, right. Sure. Well, I'm pretty passionate about this and I wish I could petition Microsoft to change this because you should fill out the to the CC in the back fields last.
00:21:42:12 - 00:22:01:21UnknownAnd why do you think that is? Because you might forget. I don't know. You might forget that a certain group has to be included or a certain person. So that's definitely true. Maybe I'm missing somebody in those fields if I if I do it too quickly in it. Because again, I don't know what I've type, but I can't send it anywhere.
00:22:01:23 - 00:22:18:02UnknownOh, if there's nothing there, I can't accidentally go oops. And should keep going on out and so I would love to petition Microsoft because it's in the upper left hand corner of your screen, Right. I want to have them put it in the lower right, because when you were in kindergarten, what did your teacher drill into your head?
00:22:18:02 - 00:22:37:09UnknownAlways put your name at the top, right? And where did you put it? In the upper left hand corner because we read left to right. Well, what do people do First? They put your dress in there. Well, it's the worst thing you can do, because if something's not ready, you can't even accidentally hit send. Now, your question about I don't know, because now they might be monitoring your keystrokes so you still could get in trouble.
00:22:37:09 - 00:22:55:24UnknownSo watch out for those nasty grams. Right. Because some people will do that to get the emotion out when they're mad and they get delete. Maybe we don't even do that anymore. Maybe find a new way to vent your vent your frustrations. But that's a good right and not send it if there's nowhere for Yes. And sure, a lot of people would appreciate that change.
00:22:56:01 - 00:23:13:00UnknownYeah. And I'm so careful with that, especially if it's something more sensitive. Yeah, I will. If it's a reply, it puts it in there immediately. Right? If it's a forward, it puts it in there immediately. I will cut and paste it somewhere else and bring it back when I'm done. If I'm worried that could accidentally hit, save, send too quickly.
00:23:13:00 - 00:23:35:22UnknownYeah, that's a great idea. So if our audience would like to learn anything else about email etiquette, do you have any recommendations for anything else Emery can offer? So we have a great class and of course I think it's great I teach it, but it's called date. It's called business Email How to write it, Right? And it's a terrific class.
00:23:35:22 - 00:24:08:17UnknownIt's a half day and we basically focus on the things we we talked about today with a much deeper dive. In addition to that, we have an even more robust class. It's business writing and all the stuff that's in the email class is also within that class. But then we get best practices for letters and text messages and emails and even how to make the tone come through better and all those types of things because we have a full day to really address lots of business writing issues because it is just so hard to read tone in any type of textual message.
00:24:08:23 - 00:24:26:22UnknownWell, we will make sure to link those two classes in the show notes below. So if you're interested, you can just take a look the show notes below and and register and have Andy as a teacher. Yeah, I'd love to see you in class or Andy. That's all the time we have today. But I want to thank you for all the great content and tips that you gave us.
00:24:26:24 - 00:24:45:01UnknownI think I will now think about this episode every time I debate sending an email, and I hope you do too. But to our listeners, if you liked our chat and topic today, I would urge you to come in any any tips you have here on email, best practices, or just anything that you want to add on to our conversation.
00:24:45:03 - 00:25:07:00UnknownDon't forget to share this episode out and consider joining MRA if you aren't a member already. Like I said, we have all the resources you need in the show. Notes below include including resources on this topic too. So thanks for tuning in today and we'll see you next week. And that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign up to connect.
00:25:07:00 - 00:25:22:04UnknownFor more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA's 30 minutes Thrive so you don't miss out. Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

Engage Your Team With Employee-designed Learning: Part 2

Description: In part 2 of this episode, we delve even deeper into the transformative world of employee-driven learning journeys. Join us as we address the crucial challenges organizations may encounter when implementing this approach and reveal expert insights on overcoming them. Plus, we'll take a fascinating peek into the future of employee development, exploring emerging trends and innovations that promise to reshape the landscape of professional growth and learning within your organization. Don't miss this essential follow-up episode for answers to the remaining key questions and get a complete roadmap to success!
Resources:
Amanda's Article in Association for Talent Development's TD Magazine 
MRA Learning & Development 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - Amanda Mosteller 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Amanda Mosteller 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:03:14 - 00:00:24:17UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:24:19 - 00:00:49:18UnknownNow it's time to thrive. All right, Well, welcome, everybody, to part two of our employee Design learning conversation. So I'm joined with Amanda Mosteller, our director of talent development here at MRA, once again to cover some remaining key questions of this topic to really ensure that you are confident in implementing this style of learning into your organizations. So thanks again, Amanda, for joining us.
00:00:49:19 - 00:01:12:11UnknownWe're excited for part two. Yes, I love talking about this. Oh, yes. Well, last episode, you kind of gave us an overview of this concept as well as some examples and some strategies to use while using employee design learning. So before we kind of kick it off, do you want to give us a little refresher of what this concept really means?
00:01:12:13 - 00:01:56:13UnknownAbsolutely. Employee designed learning is an instructional design approach that organizations can use where the instructional designer actually moves into more of a consultant role to a team of employees that have volunteered due to a passion of their own around developing their peers due to a desire that if they, their peers and their future individuals in their team are going to be going through this learning program, they have a desire to help shape what it looks like, and they have a perspective that often stakeholders and means might not be heading in what the true day to day of the average team member in that role is like.
00:01:56:15 - 00:02:39:12UnknownSo they can really help shape the design and development of the program. So employee designed learning is an instructional design approach where the idea team member is consulting a team of employees in designing classes to Thrive business strategy or the team strategy or the Gap area forward. And I would definitely encourage listeners if they haven't listened to part one, to go back now and kind of get that overview of this concept, because Amanda also highlights some great examples in real life stories of how she's kind of how to implement this in other organizations and some great success stories.
00:02:39:12 - 00:03:05:10UnknownSo I would urge you to go take a look at that. If you haven't, I second that for sure. We'll kind of dive in a little bit deeper. One concern might be that employee design learning could lack structure or consistency. So any advice on how organizations can really balance that individual customization with the need for the standardized learning outcomes?
00:03:05:12 - 00:03:35:22UnknownAbsolutely. That is where the instructional designer really is in charge and taking the lead. So the Learning committee, the learning team, the design team, whatever fun word you want to call your employee design group of individuals, the instructional designer has to make sure you're following instructional design best practices, whether Addie makes sense, whether the SAM design model makes more sense, whether you're doing a agile approach, which is part of Sam.
00:03:35:22 - 00:04:10:05UnknownBut additional waterfall approaches can apply whether you're doing, you know, quick brief stand up meetings for design on specific objectives. Whatever the strategy of design is that the instructional designer feels makes the most sense, They need to own driving that and helping the employee team learn what the design process looks like. Additionally, the stakeholders do have a part to play here, so this isn't a employees are just designing what they think would be neat.
00:04:10:05 - 00:04:33:10UnknownThe the process starts off as we talked about in the last episode with the designer, the instructional designer talking with the stakeholders about what we're trying to accomplish, what strategy are we trying to Thrive? What skills do your team members need to help you get there, or what gaps are we trying to close and what objectives are we creating to help get there?
00:04:33:10 - 00:05:11:13UnknownSo understanding the need is going to help the instructional designer Thrive the team in the right approach. Then they're responsible as part of that consulting piece in making sure we're following industry best practices in terms of what design approach fits, what type of program we're building, our timeline, how big it is, things like that. You can really run into a risk of things running wild if you put all the power in the design committee's hands, because that's not their expertise area.
00:05:11:13 - 00:05:33:02UnknownTheir expertise is the job role. Their expertise is the day to day. Their expertise is what to expect and what their own gaps are and how the organization has helped in the past or opportunities as an organization to Thrive development in these areas that haven't been there. And the instructional designer is the expert in the in the IDE approach process strategies.
00:05:33:02 - 00:06:05:21UnknownAnd then they're actually developing the materials too. So they again, they aren't they're just a consultant. They also when the when we get to PowerPoint or whatever, you know, neat visuals you are making to go along with the program, when you get to a worksheets, when you get to takeaways, the designer is also playing the heavy role of building and creating those pieces with the employee group helping guide and make sure it's what it should look like.
00:06:05:21 - 00:06:30:02UnknownMake sure it's meeting what the vision was, those kinds of things. So the designer has a very pivotal role in ensuring there is some structure and a method to whatever madness they've created. So it sounds like it's it's very much a team effort and an all hands on deck kind of thing. Yes. And that's part of how this is different than an instructional designer owning the project.
00:06:30:05 - 00:06:59:10UnknownTalking to me is maybe one, two, three me interviews to really get some information and then sending it back saying, right, because in the traditional approach, the instructional designer is doing a massive amount of the heavy lifting and, and they now have this group of employees that are really invested in a different way than your typical SME who's been tapped, who's told, you really know how to do this, we want you to help.
00:06:59:10 - 00:07:21:15UnknownAnd they might not have time or a desire or a passion. And so their investment is different and that falls on the instructional designer to bridge that investment gap. This approach, the investment is almost the instructional designer saying, hold on, I know you really want to be hands on, but let me take this one, Mark. But you're suggesting there's no objective in the world that's going to meet that.
00:07:21:15 - 00:07:46:02UnknownAnd I don't know how to design something to meet this non-existent objective. So that's part of that role. Well, we just talked about that. The concern might be the lack of structure or consistency, but do you have any other potential challenges or pitfalls that organizations might encounter with employee design learning initiatives, or any advice on how to overcome them?
00:07:46:04 - 00:08:11:16UnknownYes, I can think of two big ones that I've run into in the past. One is the famous phrase too many cooks in the kitchen. So sometimes you have a lot of employees volunteering, and their motivations behind volunteering might not be just passion and desire and a like to help develop their peers. Maybe they perceive it as getting out of their day to day job.
00:08:11:18 - 00:09:04:18UnknownSo really refining the expectations of the committee to make sure it's understood partnering with the leadership teams of the employees to make sure the people that are volunteering, they also think should or would be good at helping design. Or they do have a knowledge that they would love to replicate and have future individuals coming into that role do it that way as well, and really coming up with how many folks are the right amount of folks Instead of we'll just take anyone that volunteers because you can get way too many opinions and way too many competing ideas for what a great exercise could be or what should be a structured learning experience versus what should
00:09:04:18 - 00:09:33:00Unknownwe point folks towards blog articles or podcasts or YouTube channels to watch. If you have too many opinions involved, you will have a frustrated team, potentially an instructional designer who is struggling to manage, said team and the program can go awry and then it doesn't get the buy in from the stakeholders. That was the whole purpose in the first place.
00:09:33:02 - 00:09:56:24UnknownSo that's one that I can think of. And the other one I kind of alluded to of that. First of what someone's motivation to joining, we have to be crystal clear that this is a stretch assignment, an experiential learning opportunity, a volunteer opportunity. This does not abdicate team members from their day to day expectations of their roles as well.
00:09:56:24 - 00:10:22:18UnknownThis is a volunteered in addition to so really figuring out one is what is your employee base. If you have hourly employees, for example, then we have to find a way to involve them in this design during their shift. Or is the company so invested in this approach for a very important program that really will be key in driving us to our strategy?
00:10:22:20 - 00:10:47:20UnknownAnd so are we willing to pay overtime for the hours for those folks that join? So thinking about the expectations and how we get the employees involved and help depending on hourly salary is another thing to pay attention to, because of course, legally we we're asking them, even though it's voluntary, we're asking them to participate in something. So we need to pay them for it.
00:10:47:22 - 00:11:12:24UnknownAnd then additionally, even if I'm salaried, we have job expectations, productivity, goals, deadlines, our own things that we have to meet in our day to day is as well. So just being very clear with with the team members that volunteer, here's the expectations around what it means to be a part of this committee to Thrive designing a learning program.
00:11:13:01 - 00:11:40:07UnknownBut you also will still be expected to get all of your day to day work done as well. So this is not abdicating or in place of the regular expectations of your job. So those are some watch outs to many folks, making sure that we're focused on who is volunteering and the instructional designer. You know, they might not be as involved in understanding shifts and hourly versus salary and all all of who's volunteering.
00:11:40:07 - 00:12:11:04UnknownSo making sure there are some controls or really clear partnership with the managers of these teams so that you have the right number of folks helping the managers understand this is a development opportunity, so it's great for folks to volunteer. We will not be taking away from what their productivity is going to be to your team. We're just helping add to the value and benefit of the program, the expertise in the information that we're sharing and investment in your employees.
00:12:11:04 - 00:12:44:11UnknownThey like that. So let's allow them if they're ready. But those are some of those big watch outs that best practices are, of course, your usual right. Are you really clear in what it is and communicate it well after talking about some of these watch jobs, feel like we got to get on more of a positive note. So I think I think some of our listeners would be curious to know in what ways does employee design learning contribute to employee engagement and motivation and just overall job satisfaction?
00:12:44:13 - 00:13:15:24UnknownI think they'd also want to know if there's any specific metrics or just indicators that they can use to measure these outcomes. Absolutely. So there's a few things to think about. One, you get feedback, especially in the in the talent development space in the L.A. world around do the programs feel like they fit my job and are they clear in my expectation and and so am I going to be able to apply this in my future.
00:13:16:01 - 00:13:47:07UnknownSo from an overall team perspective, employees feel more impacted by the programs when it's more than just I talked to the one super high performer as ask me, I really had my peers help design this. I really am new to the organization and realizing that I'm working side by side with some of the people that helped build the 30, 60, 90 day onboarding, learn my job role experiences and classes and programs that I'm going through.
00:13:47:09 - 00:14:08:21UnknownAnd man, they really did a good job because it is real on on applicable to my job as I walk out of the class kind of stuff. So this really helps enhance what instructional designers know our best practice in terms of adult learning theory. How are we able to immediately apply what we're learning to our job? That's what we care about.
00:14:08:23 - 00:14:44:04UnknownIt's don't waste my time. And so overall, you're going to have satisfaction there from a folks that are volunteering to be a part of this program and are are allowed to do it. They are finding a way to shine in their expertise. Show highlight what they know to their leadership, to their peers, because at the end of the day, we know we have emerging leaders, we know we have folks within our teams that really do have a lot to share and a lot to develop.
00:14:44:06 - 00:15:11:09UnknownThere's only so many things we can make and do for people. We can't create jobs just to keep somebody around. So doing something like this allows people to step out of their normal day to day, demonstrate their expertise, practice being in an influence without authority, space practice, you know, communicating and driving change, which is what a lot of folks move into leadership.
00:15:11:15 - 00:15:35:21UnknownWhen I talk to a lot of new leaders and I say, Why are you here? I hear over and over and over again, I wanted to have a seat at the table to help Thrive the change that my team kept experiencing. I wanted to be able to impact it. And so this is another way for folks that don't have that position yet or don't really want that level of authority and therefore responsibility.
00:15:35:21 - 00:16:05:01UnknownBut they do want to help Thrive, change, help Thrive what they and their peers are being impacted by. And so from an engagement and retention perspective, something like this, you're building anyway, you have to build it anyway. The organization's going to build a program towards this anyway, so why not tap on those folks, have them step in and help in a different, much more involved way and feel like they're getting that impact.
00:16:05:03 - 00:16:47:23UnknownThey're flexing their muscles. It's a great experiential learning and stretch assignment approach and we know that people are looking for that. Absolutely. Are there any other I know we talked about just how this can contribute to employee engagement and motivation, but any other specific metrics or indicators that you can really take away from those? Sure. So often when you think from a learning program perspective, because because it's not just the volunteers on the committee, we're really looking when we do program surveys is it's so easy to get to.
00:16:48:02 - 00:17:11:04UnknownI have my instructional design hat on today is I'm thinking of all the the Bloom's taxonomy and Kirkpatrick's evaluation levels. It is so easy to get one and two for the evaluation level. One is the session itself. Did you like it? Was it helpful? And often if people like the facilitator, they'll rate things like because they like the person.
00:17:11:06 - 00:17:42:08UnknownSo that's great. That helps me know a little bit. Then level two is are you getting that knowledge growth? Are you demonstrating it whether we do it through pre and post assessments or role plays or different exercises within the sessions or within the experiences themselves to demonstrate that knowledge gain? That's that's pretty simple to do as well. Three and four gets harder so level three and then if you're in the new age.
00:17:42:08 - 00:18:07:17UnknownKirkpatrick World there's a level five, but going with the traditional level three is that transfer onto the job. So often we do something like a three month assessment back out to attendees of a program, and you would say, Are you finding you're using what we've learned, what you've learned, How has it helped? How has it changed? Give us some examples.
00:18:07:19 - 00:18:30:16UnknownSo it's one way or we have touch base conversations. As a manager, I might have an intentional. My company has created kind of a coaching sheet in three months post session and then six months post session. I might ask some fun, some questions, or as an organization you might pull a three month or six month or both learning cohort touch base back together.
00:18:30:20 - 00:18:56:03UnknownOr we're talking about how is it working. Any one of those metrics strategies is a way to gather the information. And what we found, especially in the sales example when I was doing this at that international company was the program, because we did that regularly with big programs. I mean, they were investing my whole time for a year at a time would be towards a certain program.
00:18:56:03 - 00:19:34:13UnknownSo we needed to have metrics to prove my salary was beneficial. Right? So we would, you know, yeah, it was helpful. These things were great. We felt like this these examples didn't really match what it was like. Once I got out into the sales field, once I was talking to customers and selling this stuff, and after we used this approach for the big multilevel multi-year development program, part of this big succession planning strategy, we found that those conversations and satisfaction in those 90 and six month touch bases went up.
00:19:34:15 - 00:20:02:20UnknownThe examples were much more realistic. The situations that we would practice talking to customer rebuttals were much more realistic. They weren't standard things that I was able to find. That as me would say, Yeah, that work we needs were very real scenarios that the Learning Committee had gone through and helped us design and then helped us come through not only best practices but what made sense at that organization's culture.
00:20:02:22 - 00:20:32:24UnknownSo very real. And that started to come out in those Level three evaluation checks. Level four is going to be a training department's bane of existence. It's kind of being the instructional designers hardest because you're talking ROI. I of show me your investment matters and that that could be in so many different metrics, especially depending on what the learning program is that you're building.
00:20:33:01 - 00:21:08:15UnknownIf I'm building sales strategies around a new product, I can tell what were our pre program close rates versus our three months, six month a year later program closed rates for individuals that went through the program. We can compare apples to apples that way. If you're doing something more soft skill, though, I would recommend engaging in utilizing a balanced scorecard approach where financial numbers that you or any type of data metrics is only one component of what you're looking at.
00:21:08:21 - 00:21:43:07UnknownYou're also pulling source information from those level three evaluations. You're looking at retention numbers, you're looking at external or internal customer impact satisfaction numbers. So you can pull a lot of different data pre and post to determine did this overall make sense for the financial investment, even if it's just our employees time and our full time training departments, instructional designers time to make that program makes sense.
00:21:43:09 - 00:22:04:24UnknownThat works really well for soft skill development, especially when it is a big time investment. We're talking not because any leader is going to say, I want 16 objectives and I'm going to give you about 4 hours of my team's time, wants to meet it and every instruction designer is going to shake their head because that's not possible.
00:22:05:01 - 00:22:31:19UnknownAnd so if we can use the learning Committee to advocate to meet your needs in what's feasible, and then we can show you real ROI through a balanced scorecard approach of whatever four things we want to pull. To have those pieces make sense. Then you're really proof is in the pudding that this is worth being scalable, replicable, and having your folks spend the time.
00:22:31:21 - 00:22:57:18UnknownYeah, those are those are all good examples of what metrics and indicators you can use and kind of take note of to see if you're successful. But we've also emphasized that team effort component and the importance of just having an all hands on deck with this. So we know that collaboration and communication are critical in successful instructional design.
00:22:57:20 - 00:23:26:17UnknownSo my question is how can organizations foster collaboration between the employees? The subject matter expert is meis and instructional designers. In the process of creating these personalized learning experiences. So as you're going through the design process, there's going to be natural points where the committee is going to have to go gather some more information and bring it back to the next project meeting.
00:23:26:17 - 00:23:59:09UnknownSo it really varies by how large the project is, how many programs you're creating. When I was creating the three year sales succession development program, after we got the buy in from the stakeholders of the design plan. So we followed the ADDIE model. So I won't talk to everybody. I got all of the needs analysis complete, got our volunteers, we set our expectations and then we came up with what makes sense to get us to these things.
00:23:59:09 - 00:24:27:11UnknownIt was a big combination of live instructor led experiences, some on demand experiences. We created an intentional internal only podcast to develop selling through stories. So that was an opportunity that we wanted to grow, but we just really didn't feel like it made sense to teach a class about it and then we had some specific blogs and things that we were encouraging folks to subscribe to for certain ideas.
00:24:27:13 - 00:24:50:15UnknownSo once we came up with that design, then it became creating who's owning which piece. So the instructional designers working with all of you to get it all done. Obviously we're working more heavily with our live instructor led things that we were building on demand. We had opportunities to source off the shelf type of experiences that made sense.
00:24:50:15 - 00:25:17:08UnknownSo I helped with that group. But each of these small teams, then they went out and worked with everybody else. They went out and got some ideas. So if I had some volunteers from the committee say, We want to own the Self-Guided Self-paced Resource repository, which has your blogs, your articles, your books, you'd suggest to read different things, to listen to different YouTube channels, to go follow.
00:25:17:10 - 00:25:39:08UnknownThey had ideas. They don't know every single thing out there. So they were walking around talking to their own internal network, so their own peers catching up with means and really connecting also externally like they had, you know, colleagues and peers of networks that worked in other companies that were like, Oh yeah, we're really big on this book, or we talk about this a lot.
00:25:39:08 - 00:26:06:14UnknownAnd they were bringing all of that together. So once you're getting into the development stage of instructional design, that's when it becomes just this huge partnership with anybody and everybody that has the resources and information to share. So they have to work very well together and have that good collaboration. And that's why that's such a great point, Sam, because that is why you're just taps me.
00:26:06:14 - 00:26:38:07UnknownMight not be the right person because I don't know how many smiles you can I've connected with since me, and some of them are fantastic and some of them are like, I'll give you 45 minutes once. And I'm like, okay, so they're not all they're not all known for being amazing collaborators, but so you might be a great information resource that one of our learning committee employees will reach out to and they will talk to you for that 145 minutes, you'll get us for sure.
00:26:38:09 - 00:27:00:21UnknownWe'll kind of wrapping up here. Let's look into the future a little bit. That's a landscape of work. Definitely continues to evolve. How do you envision the future of employee design learning and its impact on professional development and any trends that you think that our listeners kind of need to be prepared to embrace or organizations need to be aware of now?
00:27:00:23 - 00:27:40:10UnknownYeah, so I see it growing because I see it as an engagement strategy. I see organizations recognizing you have a lot of resources within your own internal current talent pool that can help you create very on target impactful programs. You do not need necessarily an entire specialized team for just that. You need some really strong internal consultants that know instructional design, know what's best practice, can really keep their finger on the pulse, and then engage your employee base.
00:27:40:10 - 00:28:15:00UnknownI mean, you have a lot of talent and a lot of knowledge just hanging out, working every day. So I really do see it growing because I see organizations needing to get more creative and more inventive and what engagement looks like. Engagement doesn't just have to be now. It should include, but does not just have to be the social aspect, the connectivity aspect, having swag and having great recognition and rewards programs, we have to do other things to foster everybody's thirst to continue to grow.
00:28:15:02 - 00:28:37:12UnknownAnd to your point on trends, we know we knew this in 2019. Gartner had a big research about employee engagement, and they came out with the data around how my own organization doesn't develop me, and yet I'm looking for it. I don't remember the percentage. I don't want to be wrong, so I'm not going to make one up.
00:28:37:14 - 00:29:03:13UnknownBut the research was high in that employees continue to look to their organizations to develop their career. They're no longer doing that on their own. It's becoming an expectation of the organization. And so organizations are we've already done tuition reimbursement. We've we've already done development programs. What else could we possibly do? And this is another thing to do this this can help develop lots of skills for people.
00:29:03:18 - 00:29:48:03UnknownAnd that's really what people are wanting. They're wanting skill development. They don't want another I mean, who doesn't want another certification? But that doesn't have to be a big investment like that. This can meet that and the other future trend. Hold on to your hats. Everybody is internal employee influencers and new ideas that will internal employee influencers. So as the younger Gen Zs start to enter the workforce now and five years from now, Gen Alpha's elders will start to pop in to full time work capability.
00:29:48:05 - 00:30:19:22UnknownThis is these are generations shaped by getting their knowledge from a person they trust through, not because their job role says you should trust them. So they're looking for If I want to grow in marketing, it's like taking mentoring to the next level and having an internal person who you would love to share their expertise and their knowledge with everybody, and they want it less and less produced and less and less fancy.
00:30:19:22 - 00:30:56:24UnknownSo we're talking selfie videos posted on your Internet site around Here's my top to top tip Tuesday. You do things like that that's that's what and I mean talk about employee designed get your employees involved tell them the goal and let them run with it. You'd be amazed what they can do. You'd be amazed that it's for free, amazed at that really how impactful it's going to be and how much, as you think about recruiting, engaging and retaining the next generation, there's a there's a lot a lot going down in that world.
00:30:56:24 - 00:31:21:10UnknownAnd I think that's going to be the future and we'll be talking pretty soon on. General, coming up. So shameless plug, another plug that wasn't even on purpose this time. Oh, well, I want to thank you for coming on the podcast again and share your expertise on this topic with us for part two. Absolutely. Thank you for asking me back.
00:31:21:12 - 00:31:39:11UnknownOf course, Bill, to our listeners, if you liked our chat and topic today, I'd urge you to comment something new you learn today and any questions you may have for me, I'm sure should be happy to connect with you or just anything you really want to add on to this conversation. We're curious to hear your thoughts on it.
00:31:39:13 - 00:32:02:00UnknownDon't forget to share this episode out and consider joining MRA if you aren't a member already. Like always, we have all the resources in the show notes below, including resources on this topic today. Otherwise, thank you so much for tuning in and we will see you next week. And that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect.
00:32:02:00 - 00:32:17:03UnknownFor more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA's 30 minutes Thrive so you don't miss out. Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

Insights from MRA’s 2023 CompTrends Event

Description: Every year, MRA conducts a compensation study to look at compensation and pay, from strategy to pay adjustments to market data to putting it all together with communication and transparency. In addition to publishing the survey results we also offer a webinar to talk about the results and share current trends and data. 
Our podcast listeners are getting a special look at the survey data, as well as the opportunity to hear from MRA's experts and their takeaways from the webinar and questions that were asked.
Resources:
Salary Data Aging Calculator  
2023 Compensation Trends Survey  
2023 Compensation Trends Survey Executive Summary 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - Mackenzie Button 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Mackenzie Button 
Guest Bio - Melissa Wymer 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Melissa Wymer 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR, powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:55:00UnknownNow it's time to thrive. Well, hello everybody, and welcome to this episode of 30 Minute Thrive. Today we're here to talk about compensation trends. So every year MRA conducts a compensation study to look at compensation and pay. From strategy to pay. Adjustments to market data, to putting it all together with communication and transparency. And in addition to publishing the survey results, we also offer a webinar to talk about these results and share current trends and data, which we just got done.
00:00:55:02 - 00:01:17:23UnknownSo today our podcast listeners are getting kind of a special behind the scenes look at the survey data, as well as the opportunity to hear from two compensation experts and their takeaways from the webinar and also questions that they were asked today. So let me introduce you to our experts, Mackenzie Button, MRA's Total Rewards director, and Melissa Wymer.
00:01:18:01 - 00:01:45:23UnknownOur surveys manager at MRA. So thank you to you too, for joining me today. Thanks for having us. Well, let's just dive right in into the first question. So we actually conducted a poll on social media right before this com trends webinar. And we asked organizations, what are your top concerns surrounding compensations and its trends? And we actually got 53% to say that their top concern was on compensation strategy.
00:01:46:00 - 00:02:05:13UnknownSo first, let's kind of talk a little bit about compensation strategy. Mackenzie, can you define what is a good strategy? Sure. So it's kind of funny that the 53% said that that was their top concern because I think Melissa knows from the comp trend survey that that was probably about the number that said they actually had a strategy.
00:02:05:14 - 00:02:39:03UnknownReally? Yeah. So we did see about half to respondents saying they had an actual compensation strategy. So first thing is to know that one might need to exist. And then when we work through our different projects and helping people figure out what a strategy might be, we want to look at things like your market position, how you internally value your jobs, figure out things for geography if it matters or not to your organization, internal or external equity, you know, frequency of updates and and figuring out how those things align when you know how often you want to do things.
00:02:39:05 - 00:03:08:00UnknownSo having a strategy has all those different steps in it, and you want to have it aligned with leadership too. So understanding across the organization what strategy might be and how it might impact your organization's overall strategy for sure. Kind of diving a little deeper into that question, what impact does getting your compensation right have for employers? So I think it is it can do a lot of different things for an organization.
00:03:08:02 - 00:03:30:22UnknownSo you can get the right candidates for your group with the right amount of money. It doesn't necessarily necessarily have to be above or below market, but having a good package that you put together does might not scare people away. And then it also can help retain, retain your or your employees and help them, you know, be successful and be motivated to to help your organization thrive.
00:03:31:01 - 00:03:57:08UnknownYeah, absolutely. Good answer. So MRA conducts this annual compensation trend survey, as we said about this time of year to help employers start planning for the year ahead. So, Melissa, I'm curious regarding the survey itself, was there anything that really surprised you with any of the data or results? Actually, no. Well, we had the results from a nature perspective, and I was not shocked by the results.
00:03:57:09 - 00:04:21:15UnknownYou know, pay transparency, continues to be a hot topic. Some of our respondents have pay strategies. Some do not. It is interesting to see how this all plays out. Yeah, absolutely. So, McKenzie, I know you've done this for a couple of years now, this event. So I'm curious to know how the competition trends have kind of evolved in recent years.
00:04:21:17 - 00:04:43:06UnknownSure. So I think a couple of years ago, we tried to have a title called Something along the Lines of the Power of Pay Transparency. I think we might have used it a year recently, more recent than that, but that's something. Pay transparency was an anomaly for a very long time. I mean, people in the public sector or using public funds often would see some pay transparency within their ranges.
00:04:43:06 - 00:05:07:00UnknownPeople might know what's going on, but now it's way more in the forefront. So yeah, Melissa saw it in her data from the survey that people are becoming more open, organizations are more open to pay transparent and see, and then employers are having to react to that. So if you have pay transparency, you have to have typically a range or something to anchor your jobs to and not just the person.
00:05:07:02 - 00:05:23:14UnknownSo we we still hear organizations say, you know, we ask them, how do you determine how much to pay someone? And they say, well, we looked at how much the last person made. And, you know, we try to align it with the last person in the job versus looking at it from a market perspective for a job versus a person.
00:05:23:15 - 00:05:51:19UnknownSo pay transparency is making people do a lot of things differently. And I think it's good for organizations to get their strategies aligned. Absolutely. Well, getting some data out there, some numbers out there, according to this, your survey. 95% of respondents gave pay increases in the last 12 months and respondents who provided increases over the last 12 months reported issuing an average 4.5% increase, which seems like a pretty large increase.
00:05:51:19 - 00:06:21:13UnknownSo I guess the question everyone and our listeners are probably wondering is what can we expect for next year, that percentage? Yes. So we did see pretty much an outrageous amount given COVID. And you were still dealing with the effects of COVID and we're retaining talent, but also recruiting because remote work really is the way to go. And so we have to find ways to incentivize them to come to the office.
00:06:21:15 - 00:06:48:09UnknownSo we're expecting, because the economy is stabilizing a little bit more, we are expecting it to lower down to 3.8%, which is actually the current national average them. So with that being said, the 4% is actually not as outrageous compared to other sources that we use. So like world of Work is around 4%. Wells Tower, Watts is around 4%.
00:06:48:09 - 00:07:15:06UnknownAnd then one of our other companies that we look at is actually closer to the 3.8%. Gotcha. Okay. Can I add something to that? So when we talk about it in our compensation roundtable this month, we were talking about how the survey's last year, I think everyone predicted their budgets were going to be around 4%, maybe 3.8%. And but what they really did was at 4.5%.
00:07:15:06 - 00:07:29:22UnknownSo people weren't able to stick to their budgets. They gave a little bit more than what they were planning on. So this year, seeing that the numbers are still up around the same, we'll see if people are able to you know, organizations need to give a little bit more outside of their predicted budgets for the year to year.
00:07:29:24 - 00:07:54:05UnknownThe days of 3% increases are long over. I mean, not that they were that great back prior to COVID, but I know all of my employees were like, oh, this is a cost of living increase, not a merit increase. So I don't foresee us getting back down to the 3%, but probably more that middle three to upper. 402i gotcha.
00:07:54:06 - 00:08:13:23UnknownYeah. And with anything you're going to have a range there depending on your compensation strategy, right? If you're going to do merit increases, what's important for those for those increases and what does your budget look like? Yeah. And nonprofits are going to have a hard time competing with that. I came from a nonprofit and doing 4% was just not in the budget, really.
00:08:13:23 - 00:08:39:01UnknownIt's actually fewer grant funded. Mm hmm. So in our webinar today, we got a ton of chat questions. I think we got over like 48. Yes. So today I'm just I pulled out a few of them to go over. So the first one says, regarding aggregators, some comp professionals do recommend them, but the caution was just given to not rely solely on these pay factors, comp analysts, etc. per purchase.
00:08:39:01 - 00:09:04:09UnknownThe trusted surveys to create their data sets. So how often do you see a truly significant difference in the aggregated data on the trusted source data? Anyone can take this on though. I think for the for the aggregators, they they can be good. But even with any survey source, they are not every job is going to be in there for every different survey cut and being able to fill in the gaps with an algorithm.
00:09:04:11 - 00:09:21:03UnknownThat's where we usually want to dig in and see how many people have reported on it in this area. So if there's, you know, what's your number you use, what's the I have five or more, then we can respond on the data cut. So the the aggregators will be saying there might be zero people that have responded, but they're able to report on that data point.
00:09:21:05 - 00:09:42:01UnknownSo it's just making sure you're using them with, you know, with some caution and with your eyes open and seeing if, you know, the data seems too good to be true. They probably are people reporting on it. The right not even be those industries in the area. Right. Just make sure you're looking at other sources to to to align that that you can validate whether participants and in numbers.
00:09:42:03 - 00:10:04:10UnknownSo there is also a lot of tech questions around aging data. So one of them was what percentage do you use to age data? Oh, this is always a fun question because there's two factors when considering it. You want to know what the percentage which is typically aligned to the average market salary increase and then the desired date you want to use.
00:10:04:10 - 00:10:30:14UnknownIf you plan to update your salary ranges in 2024 and the salary survey effective date is March of 2023, using a 4% as a market average salary increase, that data would be aged around 3.3%. The formula is usually ten divided by 12 times 0.4. So there's a fun little formula for it. And we also have that formula on our website for members to use.
00:10:30:16 - 00:10:56:03UnknownOkay. Well, we'll include that in the resources then. So another question we got was as pay transparency becomes more common, we'll start to see salary ranges included in job postings more often. So do you anticipate this becoming a more valid data source as more companies transition to open communication regarding positions and ranges? So I think Melissa has a good point to talk about.
00:10:56:03 - 00:11:17:19UnknownLike the we have the data points of like the five different levels of transparency. And one of the things is like, do do you tell your employees about what's on more than just on their paycheck? Do you train your employees on it? So it's one thing to actually be proactive and train them on this points. And the other perspective is we post it and they have to go looking for it and then they might come ask questions.
00:11:17:19 - 00:11:43:00UnknownSo are you proactive about it with the pay transparency if you have to post it or are you, you know, more reactive because people see, you know, you're not sending them links to the job that they're in that you're hiring for, but you know, you have to be reactive. Yeah. McKenzie brings up a really good point. As I know, before even Ohio in Cincinnati was probably was in the timing.
00:11:43:02 - 00:12:29:15UnknownBut some of our major cities in Ohio are having their position their pay scale bad hosted. And it did cause a lot of issues and lowered morale, especially when it came to someone just job hunting and then they stumble upon, oh, my company's hiring. Oh, I make way less than that for players. So being able to have that tough conversation and mentally prepare your staff, I know with us it was difficult to have those conversations, but also being transparent and hey, yes, we know you're underpaid.
00:12:29:15 - 00:12:56:09UnknownThis is our plan to correct that. Mm hmm. And just being open again, I always like to say, if you have a range, try to stick within it. Right. So if people do see those ranges posted and they're below the minimum, then that's definitely something you should be reviewing. Yeah. Well, as we kind of wrap up today, McKenzie, I know you talked about some hot trends in your webinars, so can you and nurse with some of those hot trends for 2024 in relation to compensation?
00:12:56:13 - 00:13:17:01UnknownSo we already talked too much about AI and we're still all learning about that too. But from the total rewards perspective we are seeing, yeah, that shift, that big thing that's shifting from what what are we spending our money on and is it what our employees want us to be spending our money on so much? And I talked about the, you know, polling your your employees to see what's important to them.
00:13:17:06 - 00:13:49:02UnknownAnd then I think when we had one of the questions in the chat about being, you know, what are some some lower cost options or ones that aren't hitting the budget too hard that can really motivate employees or attract the right candidates. So we think that balance of compensation benefits, the work life balance, the four different quadrants that we talk about when we look at total rewards, total compensation, you know, it's really balancing those things out to keep your workforce happy and getting the right people to work for, you know, some good trends to keep in the back of your head.
00:13:49:04 - 00:14:10:19UnknownYeah. Well, thank you both for coming on to the podcast today and great job with the webinar. I appreciate both of you. And to our listeners, if you liked our chat and topic today, I would urge you to share out this episode. Consider joining MRA if you aren't a member already. We have all the resources you need in the show notes below, including resources from today.
00:14:10:21 - 00:14:33:06UnknownOtherwise, thank you so much for tuning in today and thank you both and we'll see you next week. Thanks. Thanks. And that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect. For more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA's 30 minutes drive so you don't miss out.
00:14:33:06 - 00:14:37:24UnknownThanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

MRA’s September Talent Report with Jim Morgan

Description: 🎙️ Tune in now to the latest episode of the podcast - the September Talent Report! Stay in the know about all things business, with a spotlight on talent trends and best practices. This month, we're diving deep into the world of compensation and total rewards - essential insights you won't want to miss! 💼💰
Resources:
Talent Report+ Webinar Series 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - Jim Morgan 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Jim Morgan 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR, powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:42:06UnknownNow it's time to thrive. Well, hello everybody, and welcome to this episode of 30 Minute Thrive. It is that time again to go over this month's talent report with Jim Morgan, MRA's vice president of Workforce Strategies. So we'll dive into what he's been seeing in the world of business in September. So thanks, Jim, for being here today. Yeah, my pleasure.
00:00:42:06 - 00:01:11:03UnknownIt's good to be back. Well, for September, your extended or featured topic of the month was on compensation in total rewards. So I'm wondering why you chose this topic for for September. Well, we've got our big comp trends event coming up in a little over a week now. And the timing of that is not coincidentally, is companies are right now sort of going into budget season, preparing for 2024 and those that are on a calendar year.
00:01:11:05 - 00:01:33:22UnknownYou know, we've just found that this is a really good time for us to start talking about compensation and benefits for the next year, providing them what we've learned so far in 2023. And it's always a game, you know, that, oh, we could be the first ones to come out, but then we come out with data in May, and by the time you're budgeting, it's like, Well, that data is already six months old and it'll be nine months old by the time we start the year.
00:01:33:24 - 00:01:51:18UnknownBut if you wait too long, people are like, I got to put something in there because I have to figure out what's happening. So I think Maria just sort of made the strategic decision that says we can start getting that data out there in middle or late September. It gives everybody October and November to to budget to figure out their next year, to figure out salaries.
00:01:51:18 - 00:02:13:21UnknownIf they've got compensation needs, they've got time to still do some work on it. And so that's how we end up with compensation being about this time of the year. Good topic. Good month. Yeah. Let's talk about what's happening in the recruiting and retention world right now. So I know you focused on Gen Z strategies that companies are kind of employing right now.
00:02:13:21 - 00:02:37:12UnknownSo can you name off some of those strategies? Yeah, You know, and it's well, it's a generational thing because it's Gen Z right now that are the new and younger people coming into the work. I think it would apply to just about anybody. But I also think people have to understand what the Gen Z workers went through with the pandemic as an example.
00:02:37:14 - 00:02:56:18UnknownThey were in their last couple of years of college maybe, or their last couple of years of high school or their first year of work or something. And those are pretty critical times, too, all of a sudden to be kind of cooped up and things like that. So I think that's Thriven things a little bit. And the fact that the market for talent has just been upside down.
00:02:56:20 - 00:03:19:02UnknownSo what we've seen is a lot more companies are promoting their emotional health benefits, talking about the things that they have available to people. You know, with each generation, I think we get a little bit more open and honest about mental health. There was something we used to not even talk about or as a sign of weakness, you know, now it's almost I need somebody to talk to.
00:03:19:02 - 00:03:35:02UnknownI'm going to grab anybody and I'm going to have a conversation with them. But it's and it's really important to younger workers. And so they're they're using that now, I think, as a selling point to say this is we know this is important to you and we're going to put it out there as one of the benefits that we've got.
00:03:35:04 - 00:03:56:04UnknownThey're also trying to be a little bit more, I think, transparent on pay and benefits, because if you're just entering the workforce or you've only been there for a year or two and you're Googling, hey, how much should I be making? You're probably getting some pretty wild numbers, some pretty good looking numbers, but not necessarily the most accurate ones.
00:03:56:04 - 00:04:29:08UnknownAnd they don't realize that for someone living in downtown New York or whatever it might be. And so I think helping younger workers understand what the market really is, how they set their compensation, that it's competitive, it's benchmarked. While younger workers may not necessarily be all that interested in that, I think it gives them a little bit more of a reality when they come in saying, Oh yeah, that $100,000 and you're you as an employer, like we have people of 15 years of experience that are doing that job and making $100,000.
00:04:29:09 - 00:04:49:04UnknownSo trying to just give them a little bit more background and information. And then lastly, you know, we're at this generational tipping point, and I think we might have talked about this before, but, you know, we're a couple of years away from the Gen Z's and the millennials outnumbering the Gen Xers and the baby boomers. Why is that a big deal?
00:04:49:06 - 00:05:17:05UnknownYou want very different benefits than what I want. And we're going to have to start making some of those adjustment settings. More of the people who go out looking like me with what we've traditionally had and coming in looking like you and wanting different things that they're asking more questions about what matters to you, what do you value, and just taking one of the simplest ones being health care, which has always been an incredible benefit for people and you have got to have that.
00:05:17:07 - 00:05:36:19UnknownYou can be on your parent's health care till you're 26. So 22, 23, 24, 25, that doesn't have a whole lot of value to you at a time when I'm trying to secure you as an employee in my organization and keep you if you're good. So what do you want instead? And how do we start trying to take a look at those things?
00:05:36:19 - 00:06:00:14UnknownSo I think there's a little bit more conversation and listening going on around the benefits. You know, Jim, I'd like a Netflix subscriber option that was cheaper than health care. So maybe we'll see if we can get you one. Well, like we said, we were focusing on compensation, total rewards this month. But last month we kind of focus on the AI and inclusivity.
00:06:00:15 - 00:06:26:15UnknownSo you actually launched a couple of DIY poll questions last month and you have the results now. So do you want to kind of share out what those poll results were? Yeah, I'd be glad to. And, you know, again, another event we've got coming up is our DIY conference, and this was really because the AI was the topic last month and it just helps us constantly sort of stay in touch with where our members are to find out what's going on.
00:06:26:16 - 00:06:49:21UnknownSo we asked last month, you know, where are you on your DIY journey for the people that were attending the talent Report webinar, we had 46% say they were just beginning, 31% doing their, you know, doing pretty well. So 77% of the group is sort of in that, yeah, you know, our feet or what we're kind of moving, but we're not there yet.
00:06:49:23 - 00:07:11:18UnknownSo I'll come back to that 21% who haven't started and 2% saying that they're fully implemented. So, you know, just a quick. All right. I see what's going on out there is that, you know, people are they're doing things. I think they realize they have to do things. It's an expectation of younger workers is an expectation if you're in a talent supply chain of the people.
00:07:11:18 - 00:07:35:09UnknownFurther up the food chain are saying, you know, we're looking at your diversity and what you're doing there. So people are they're they're getting started, but they're just not there yet. And I think we're seeing fewer and fewer now that haven't started at all and those who haven't started at all. Just looking at why that was, which was the next question, really, it was around two things.
00:07:35:10 - 00:08:07:13UnknownOne was leadership commitment, especially in a smaller company, maybe less than 100 employees. If you don't have the leadership ready to go, that makes it quite a bit more difficult. And the second one was just not having the time and the people and the resources to know where do we start? Because it would be great for us to say, Oh, we're launching this DIY initiative, but if nobody's got the time to see it through, to put the activities in place, to put the initiative in place, to figure out what we're doing, how we're doing, it communicated to everyone that it's not going to get very far.
00:08:07:15 - 00:08:27:22UnknownSo I think, you know, the positive is more and more people are initiating starting moving along on the journey. The hard thing is, is just making sure we've got everything in place. And that means leadership is committed. We've put some resources into it. We've got the employees fired up about it and it's a big deal. So it's ongoing.
00:08:27:22 - 00:09:05:08UnknownI think it continues to be a journey for people. But slowly but surely we're we're moving along, get results. So another topic that I'd like to dive into is are talent thinking section, where you kind of highlight the recruiting and candidate process. So any new up and coming things this month or just anything to highlight on this. Yeah there was a really good benefit study that came out by Ernst and Young and I actually circulated it around here and I, I just sort of put a little disclaimer on it that said, I know this doesn't sound like a really exciting topic, but the information they've got is really good.
00:09:05:08 - 00:09:30:22UnknownIt might be worth taking a look at. And they had a lot of discussion around that generational tipping point that I was just talking about a couple of minutes ago that says, how does this change the game in terms of what's going on out there? So few of the things that you know, that they mention and that, you know, I'm seeing and hearing when I when I'm out in the field is this whole gig economy and remote work has just changed the game and we all know that.
00:09:30:24 - 00:09:52:23UnknownBut when you stop and think about, okay, have we really accepted yet that the norm has changed that where people are working, when they're working, how they are working, lots of different expectations and what employers have to do to be clear about what is a remote job and what's not a remote job. And when we say work remote, this is what we mean.
00:09:53:00 - 00:10:16:02UnknownAnd here are the policies that we have around remote work and starting. You see some of the pushback on that that yeah, so if you can work remote, we don't have any problem with that. But if you've got three kids running around in the background or every time we call you your phone in your laundry or you're at the grocery store, when we have a Zoom call, at some point I'm going to start asking some questions and say, you know, I get it, you know, once in a while.
00:10:16:02 - 00:10:39:18UnknownBut boy, this seems to be sort of the pattern of what's happening out there. So the gig economy, remote work has changed things and employers are having to to adjust to that. The benefits issue that I was just talking about, really knowing our people and it's getting a little bit more personalized because I think it really means someone has to sit down with people and say what matters to you?
00:10:39:24 - 00:10:59:17UnknownBecause health care may or may not be a big thing. Loan payments may or may not be a big thing. A Netflix subscription may or may not be a big thing, but we got to know our folks to know what it is that we're going to offer. Because if we just sit in a room and two of us talk and say, I know what we should do, we should offer everyone packed insurance.
00:10:59:19 - 00:11:26:10UnknownOkay, great. How many of our people have pets? Well, I don't have any idea. All right, well, then why are we doing it? Well, everybody else seems to be offering it. Maybe everybody's got one. They think it was the greatest thing. But what does that mean? And not everybody's going to want to take advantage of it. So how do we let people begin to figure out what they want and where they are in their employee lifecycle so that we're actually providing things that that that matter to them?
00:11:26:12 - 00:11:45:12UnknownSo that I think is really the biggest thing. The last one that we're seeing more of is everyone's got HR Information systems now that are designed to make life easier for us. We can go right in and do our vacation. We can put our pto time and see what's going on. Just by going online, we can figure out when we're going to be gone.
00:11:45:12 - 00:12:05:15UnknownWe can see what our salary is, what our withdrawals are, what our benefits are. All that stuff is now online, and that's becoming more and more of a technology Thriven process that employees, especially younger ones, are not not thinking. I got to walk down the hall and find an HR person and talk to them. I can go online.
00:12:05:15 - 00:12:26:13UnknownI've got an app on my phone. I can see exactly how many days off I have when the vacation days are coming up. And a lot of that is sort of working in the virtual world again, that how do we make all that information accessible to people and make it easier for them to manage their own benefits. So those are a few of the things that they were talking about seeing.
00:12:26:13 - 00:13:05:14UnknownAnd I think we can sort of confirm that with what we're hearing to kind of expanding on that technology Thriven aspect. This month. I know you're also talking about employees having a I policies and just leveraging AI in general. So can you talk a little bit more about what you're finding this month with with AI? Yeah, the AI is just fascinating, unknown new past year, you know, A.I. has been around for a long time, but I think the Chad GP like just brought it into the every day lexicon and now everybody is all right, what are we going to do with it?
00:13:05:14 - 00:13:33:01UnknownWhat's going to happen? What does it mean? Where is this information going? In HR? I think especially this is a big deal because to the extent that people are relying on artificial intelligence to do some things in the world, you know, the caveat on this is, are you doing an analysis of what A.I. is doing? Does it have unintentional disparate impact on disqualifying candidates?
00:13:33:03 - 00:13:53:18UnknownIf you're writing job descriptions and things like that, are they being written in a way that is not discriminatory? So there's a lot there's a lot of caveats behind it. And that I would say to anyone who's listening is that's a legal team question. That's let's make sure we're doing okay. So having said all of that, it does bring an awful lot into the HR world.
00:13:53:24 - 00:14:14:10UnknownAnd so you are seeing companies that say, you know, we can generate a list of expected skills and qualifications for a job. You know, we can type it in, we can see what comes back. And I would never just say, Oh, it came back. Here it is like posted. I think it comes back and you've got to look at it, you've got to read it, you've got to review it, you have to personalize it for your company.
00:14:14:16 - 00:14:31:16UnknownBut it certainly can give you a start in terms of the information that you might be looking for. It might be a way to you know, it can search for alternative phrases. So maybe your job descriptions were written two or three, five, ten years ago. It can search for things and find a new way of saying a thing.
00:14:31:17 - 00:14:58:15UnknownSame things, but maybe in more modern day nomenclature so it can help you with that. We had a company that used it to develop our social media strategy to say, If this is what we're doing, where might we go and with which platforms? And so again, it can generate some ideas for you. Draft jab, Jab, announcement is four different things generate interview questions for people.
00:14:58:17 - 00:15:22:17UnknownSo it's there's just so much that is capable now it's just understanding just like you know with Google, with Chad, GPT, with AI all of those things. Where is the information coming from? How has it been vetted? Who's looking at it? Because you just can't take anything off the shelf and say, This is it. So that's my that's my disclaimer on all of it.
00:15:22:21 - 00:15:39:10UnknownBut people are also just trying to figure out how do we use this to save us some time? And it's going to take me 2 hours to generate some interview questions can generate 20 of them in a second and then say, Wow, these three are pretty good. I'll rewrite them. The rest of these aren't good. I'll come up with two on my own.
00:15:39:12 - 00:16:03:17UnknownSo I think a lot of it right now is time savings. How do we use it to just be more efficient? What it's going to mean in the future, I think is it's going to be wild. I had I had a friend who got an email from their boss and they didn't know how to respond and they're like, No, I just asked Chad how to respond.
00:16:03:19 - 00:16:29:15UnknownSo I thought that was just crazy. It was kind of shows like you are using it in everyday life. Yeah, and it's got you know, you have the ability now to say what sort of tone do you want it to write in? Is it direct, legal and straightforward? Is it kind of fun and friendly? And, you know, and it's just again, I would read everything, but, you know, you can see how selecting different words makes it come across a little bit differently.
00:16:29:15 - 00:16:52:08UnknownAnd what's the brand of our company and how do we want it to sound? There's it's it's really fast. It's a fascinating time to be dealing with those things. So your quote of the month was even about I said I might not take your job, but someone who knows and understands I will. So can you explain that quote a little bit more?
00:16:52:10 - 00:17:07:00UnknownYeah, I heard that. And in a webinar that I was on and, you know, it just it immediately got me thinking that, you know, everyone is, oh, I'm going to take my job, it's going to take my job. And are there some jobs that are mentioned? Yeah, sure. I'm sure that there are some that are going to be that way.
00:17:07:02 - 00:17:35:01UnknownBut just about everything has a human component to it, you know, that's still involved. And so I think the presenter was simply saying it's not sort of a black and white, it's either Sophie or artificial intelligence. But if I have a Sophie and a Sophie who understands artificial intelligence, the second Sophie is probably going to figure out how to blend those two things together and come out with a better product, a more efficient, more effective way of doing things.
00:17:35:03 - 00:17:58:14UnknownAnd so you are starting to see employers now start to, you know, not that you have to be an expert in it and be trained in and have a master's degree in it and know how to do artificial intelligence analysis, but at least to know what's out there and what's it capable of and what can it do that I think is going to be a selling point for some people as they are switching jobs or entering into the job market.
00:17:58:16 - 00:18:33:11UnknownFor sure. Well, this month in charts, our favorite section you've included where the different generations are moving to. So can you explain what the charts shown some of the stats there and where the data is kind of coming from here? Yeah, this one was really I thought it was interesting and I don't think anyone's going to change their world based on this, but LinkedIn had taken a look at everyone who had pursued a job online and had changed their online posting that it didn't say that JPMorgan was at MRA and Waukesha.
00:18:33:12 - 00:18:52:04UnknownNow Jim Morgan was now working for Catapult in North Carolina so they could see, okay, there is a baby boomer and they just took a job in North Carolina and they can see the movement. And so they they just did some analysis of that. And I just sort of found it interesting that when you look at the younger people and you're like, okay, where are they going?
00:18:52:04 - 00:19:12:16UnknownAnd you see Boston, Massachusetts, Raleigh, Durham, Chapel Hill, Austin, Texas, Madison, Wisconsin. You know, number four, you're seeing those Denver, Nashville, Minneapolis, the places that you know, yeah, it sounds like kind of the hip places. And that's where people are going to. And if we've got a company and a brand that's attracting younger people, hey, we're in the right place.
00:19:12:18 - 00:19:31:24UnknownThese folks are moving here and taking jobs here. You know, interesting. Does it change what we do? I don't know. Maybe not. You know, and then I start looking at, okay, where are the baby boomers that maybe now are, you know, 55, 60 and they're moving jobs. Where are they going? Austin is still high in Raleigh is still high.
00:19:32:04 - 00:20:00:02UnknownBut then you see Cape Coral, Florida, in Sarasota, Florida, and Phenix, Arizona, and kind of a different you know, and you understand that there's warmer weather, there's more people that are a little bit older there. There's some duplicates in all of this. But you can see that younger people are going to these fast moving, more hipster places. Older folks are going more towards where there are other people like me, whereas they're lower taxes, whereas they're really good weather year round.
00:20:00:04 - 00:20:19:15UnknownSo it starts to just sort of give you an impression of what's going on out there. And then for what it's worth, overall, they said if you just looking for where are folks going, it was number one, Austin, number two, Raleigh, Durham, Chapel Hill, number three, Denver and number four, Nashville. So those are kind of the the hotspots right now.
00:20:19:15 - 00:20:45:22UnknownAnd all of those are in the town that report this month. Well, as we kind of wrap up here, I've always got to ask, Jim, can you give us a sneak peek on what October's talent report topic will be? Yeah, and let me before I share that big secret with one other thing that we did this month was when we were talking to all of our C-suite roundtables, we asked them a little bit about, Hey, what's keeping you up at night?
00:20:45:22 - 00:21:07:08UnknownYou know, what's driving you crazy here? And these are just a couple of the leading ones that came out of it, That from a CEO and CFO point of view, I thought, you know, might be of interest to some of your podcast listeners. Hiring and talent retention remains at the top of everybody's list. I think everyone just knows that's having an impact throughout the organization process and workflow improvements.
00:21:07:10 - 00:21:30:00UnknownI think there's really this concentrated how do we do more with less? How do we get the most out of each person? Where do we need automation, Where do we need some other things? So those are top of mind for them. Big organizational change issues. Maybe it's an organizational restructuring, it's a new CRM term, it's a merger and acquisition, a lot more activity in those areas.
00:21:30:00 - 00:21:51:15UnknownSo that's a big one for them. Preparing the next generation of Sofi bowlers, that's a big one for everybody. You know, how do we take that next generation of leader who might be taking over a little bit sooner with a little less experience, make sure that they're they're ready. Cybersecurity, Top of everybody's mind is our new horror story every day.
00:21:51:15 - 00:22:14:05UnknownSo they're working on those and then employee benefits for all the reasons that we just talked about, you know how do we make sure that we're competitive with everybody and we're offering, you know, what what it is that that that our people want. So anyway, ad for next month, the topic is building the generational bridge. And it'll be talking a little bit about this generational tipping point.
00:22:14:07 - 00:22:37:04UnknownHow do we help everybody communicate within the workforce? How do we, you know, take all the these the zoo animals, the millennials, and replace all those baby boomers and after that, the Xers? And how do we make that a nice, smooth transition? Because I would argue those are two pretty different sets of generations. And it's just going to take a little bit extra effort to make sure that we have a smooth transition.
00:22:37:08 - 00:22:58:12UnknownAnd then yeah, it's a great topic. Excited for that? Yeah, looking forward to it. Well Jim, thanks again for all like great content today. And just recapping what you've been seeing and what our members are seeing in the world of business with an emphasis on talent. This month in September. So I would just encourage our listeners, don't forget to share out this episode.
00:22:58:14 - 00:23:20:01UnknownConsider joining MRA. If you are not a member, we have all the resources you need in the show notes below, including resources on this talent report and upcoming webinars. Otherwise, thanks for tuning in today and we'll see you all next week. And that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign up to connect
00:23:20:01 - 00:23:35:05UnknownFor more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA's 30 minutes Thrive so you don't miss out. Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

Engage Your Team With an Employee-designed Learning Experience

Description: Discover how organizations are empowering their workforce to take the reins of their own development, creating tailored and impactful learning journeys. Hear real-life examples, inspiring stories, and actionable strategies that will transform the way you approach professional growth and training within your organization.
Resources:
Amanda's Article in Association for Talent Development's TD Magazine 
MRA Learning & Development 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - Amanda Mosteller 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Amanda Mosteller 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR, powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:41:19UnknownNow it's time to thrive. Well, hello, everybody, and thanks for joining us today. I'm here with Amanda Mosteller, director of Talent Development. She's in our MRA, Ohio division. But, Amanda, welcome back. I know you've been down on one show so far. We're glad to have you back for a second one. Thank you. Thank you for asking me to be back.
00:00:42:00 - 00:01:13:19UnknownOh, of course. But for those who don't know, don't know. Amanda, Amanda's area of expertise really aligns with areas of the talent development industry. She spends her time in developing learning programs, designing talent development strategy, driving business metrics assessed through their people, and individual success through coaching. So today, we're really going to be covering employee design learning. And when when we talked about doing this episode, Amanda, you were also middle of writing an article on this topic too.
00:01:13:20 - 00:01:52:09UnknownSo our listeners, to stay tuned for that release date and we'll get you the link. Absolutely. But kind of starting off a little overview here. Could you explain what employee design learning really means and how it differs from traditional approaches to professional development? Yes. Yes. So employee designed learning programs, put the employees in the driver's seat of creating the learning experience of the program that they themselves, their colleagues and future individuals that come into roles like theirs will experience in terms of their development.
00:01:52:11 - 00:02:28:12UnknownSo the difference here is we are leveraging the instructional designer to design and build everything. We are leveraging employees that have a passion for development and a desire to really shape what they, their colleagues and their future selves will be impacted by what they're going to go through. This is a knowledge base and a resource to tap that is really going to impact what everything looks like and really what we focus on.
00:02:28:14 - 00:03:01:12UnknownSo how it differs is instructional designers become more of a consultant and a coach to an employee individual or team, depending on how big the learning program's going to be. So traditionally instructional designers own and manage and go through all of this and they touch on smells and this feels different because you are leveraging different resources and you are positioning yourself as the designer in a different way.
00:03:01:14 - 00:03:28:04UnknownSo those are the ways that we see this differ in employee design learning versus traditional instructional design processes, because the employees play the largest role. And in creating this program or programs depending on how large it is. So in your experience, what are some of the key benefits of involving employees in the design of their own learning experience?
00:03:28:07 - 00:03:55:05UnknownAnd how does this really impact their engagement and skill development? No, it's not a good one though. So, you know, traditionally instructional designers connect with key stakeholders. This is often leadership within the organization who's kind of out of touch with what the roles that are being impacted by the program actually experience in their day to day and where their true development needs are.
00:03:55:06 - 00:04:22:13UnknownSo when we flip this approach and we put employees in the design driver seat, you're going to get insights, you're going to get tailored programing. That's reality for what their lives truly are like. So the way we partner with stakeholders is we ask them, strategically, where are you trying to go? This is a common instructional designer question As you're developing a program, what are we trying to meet?
00:04:22:13 - 00:04:54:22UnknownWhat are we trying to do? That's kind of where we end with the stakeholders for now. So we say, Excellent, thank you for giving me the strategic vision. We're identifying what skills, what knowledge, skills and abilities the individuals within your organization need to possess to get you to that vision. Put a pin in that. We'll be back. And then this program and this approach really says to the employees, Here's what we're trying to do as an organization, as a business.
00:04:54:22 - 00:05:16:19UnknownHere's where we're trying to go. Here's what we need to be able to do to get us there. Where are you at? What are we doing today? What are some of the barriers that you typically don't get development in that you need? What are we missing? What skills are we not aware of? What areas don't we know that your roles need?
00:05:16:23 - 00:05:37:15UnknownAnd this is different than just me because with this me, they give this conversation, they give you some advice, they give you some resources, and they're like, All right, call me if you need me. But the employee designed learning approach really says to the employees, okay, you don't get to tell me this and then walk away. You get to help me build all of this.
00:05:37:16 - 00:06:17:16UnknownSo the benefits are one, really connecting to reality of what the employees need, of what the roles truly need to know sometimes again, well intentioned leaders, still, there's a lot of things they're doing that are different. Our heads are lifted up. We're looking further ahead. We're not doing the day to day. So sometimes we think there are tools and resources that are readily available or that employees, the individual contributors are aware of or that they're coming in the door with and they're not.
00:06:17:20 - 00:06:47:01UnknownSo we have to really identify how do we make them aware, what can we leverage as well as what are they, what is coming in the door with truly look like and only the people doing the work that also have a passion for development, which is another way putting the employees in the driver's seat and creating this what we would call a learning committee or a design committee differ from potentially a meeting.
00:06:47:03 - 00:07:09:22UnknownThese are folks that have a passion for developing their colleagues and for impact, doing the experience that they might have to go through with the end of this anyway. And your traditional Smee might not be someone that has a passion for development, so they might give the instructional designer the bare minimum of the required time that they've been tapped for.
00:07:09:24 - 00:07:39:07UnknownSo employee designed learning, the folks that are part of it volunteer to be part of it. So that's an important differentiator as well. We are asking for volunteers to be part of a design committee. We're being upfront with time, expectations, goals. What these individuals are going to be doing. So they're aware of what they're committing to, but they have a desire to commit to it.
00:07:39:09 - 00:08:17:16UnknownWhether that is experiential learning for themselves or growth strategies. For an individual who is doing a stretch assignment this way, they might be meeting their own personal professional goals while benefiting their team and their future new hires or future colleagues as well. So you're really utilizing an approach that puts employees not only in the driver's seat of designing, but employees with a different level of investment, with a different level of connection to the day to day work.
00:08:17:16 - 00:08:43:21UnknownSo they can truly tell us you want us to get there strategically. Here's what we need to be able to do. Here's the things you need to teach us about. Here's the resources we don't have today that we need to find. And then a group that says, I'm not just going to tell you this in one meeting and then have you come back to me designer with the rough outline and with the content and saying, Yep, you did it.
00:08:43:22 - 00:09:06:16UnknownThis is a group that's going to say, I'm going to help you pull together the outline. I'm going to help you pull together the content, I'm going to help identify great resources that we should make more intentional in raising my colleagues awareness, too. So this is a group that really, from start to finish, is a part of every step of the way.
00:09:06:17 - 00:09:28:16UnknownThey're not just interviewed a couple of times. They're knee deep in helping create, not doing it. I'm not saying they're going to make the PowerPoints and they're going to make the learner materials. The instructional designer is still doing that, but they are much more of a guide for these folks as to what the kind of right resources are.
00:09:28:16 - 00:10:02:08UnknownAnd if we say we're meeting this objective, we should probably have some activities in there. What activities would make sense and help me figure out what they are. Help me design them. So it's really getting a deep investment and then when you actually run the program, not only do you have great buy in, but man, do you have a great crew of individuals who are going out to their colleagues to say no, when you come to this class, come in ready to learn, because it's going to be what we need because we helped build it?
00:10:02:10 - 00:10:32:12UnknownYeah. And I would imagine that this definitely, positively impacts engagement and skill development. But do you have any other thoughts on that and how it's really impacting engagement among employees? MM Yeah, you know, I used to be really proud of programs that I would build that I would think me and we hit the mark. This is the best daggone program I use all the new bells and whistles and everything my certification taught me to do.
00:10:32:12 - 00:11:04:02UnknownI am so good. And then I would have folks come out of the program like that was fun. But what about bullet point? Bullet point, bullet point of things that I still can't do. Like, I can't do that. That's not reality to my day to day. Who you talk to when you come up with this. So, you know, when you're having folks that truly live the day to day help create something that the stakeholders sign off on.
00:11:04:02 - 00:11:33:02UnknownBecause as I mentioned, we tell the stakeholders to put a pin in it. Once we come up with the design plan and what it's going to look like and what the best delivery modality is and what the best cadence is and how long these things should be, we go back and the design committee, maybe one representative of the design committee or the committee themselves, again, depending on how large of a program you're building, can be a big committee.
00:11:33:02 - 00:12:00:04UnknownIt might be one or two people would go with you to the stakeholders, you being the instructional designer, to say, Here's where we're at, here's what we think is going to get the biggest bang. And then you have stakeholders saying, sure, I mean, tell the employees who do the work know if we don't want the program that you think will get us there, of course they're going to have stakeholder buy in to what you're recommending.
00:12:00:06 - 00:12:35:01UnknownAnd then you have employees who see who are aligned with their leadership. So it's this whole full circle of everybody being on the same page for what this experience program, whole program, long term series might be, because you also run into as an instructional designer and my other ID folks out there will not in agreement with this where stakeholders will give you a list of goals and you'll set up all these objectives and they'll say, Yeah, we need you to get that done in one two hour virtual life.
00:12:35:03 - 00:13:13:07UnknownYou're like, Oh, I'm sorry. You just gave me enough objectives to meet in three full days. You want me to do it in 2 hours of heads up? Yeah, right. That would have been something to tell me ahead of time. So? So this really becomes collaborative in a different way where, again, the instructional designer is kind of facilitating and guiding and consulting and helping everyone to create a program that everybody is in agreeance that this is the way to get the needs met for our team members that will get us strategically to where we're trying to go.
00:13:13:12 - 00:13:42:21UnknownSo it's this full circle connection and a full circle by in because my peers are going to be more invested in coming to a class that I know my colleagues designed, not, you know, instructional designer and the VP who hasn't done this job in ten plus years themselves. So it it really creates buy in top down and everyone coming into the class is aware that this is a this was designed differently.
00:13:42:23 - 00:14:04:24UnknownI've had experiences where means were tapped because they are the best at what they do, but they don't have that passion for learning. But also they too might be disconnected from the majority of their colleagues. And the bell curve there, the extreme high potential, and we're ready to move them on to the next role. And so they should be the person you're talking to.
00:14:05:01 - 00:14:58:21UnknownAnd while their colleagues might be really motivated by excuse me, that individual and where they're going, the strategies that individual might have been recommending, either we aren't really going to replicate or again, might not be realistic to the majority of the group's day to day. So it's a balancing act as a designer, as an instructional designer to put in best practices, effective strategies, encourage people to stretch themselves while not being so unrealistic that the program truly missed and the best way to ensure alignment all around, and that the program isn't going to miss the mark is by involving more employees that have a desire, that have a goal, and that have a realistic view of
00:14:58:21 - 00:15:40:22Unknownwhat the role is really like. Absolutely. That's a great point. You know that we love stories on the podcast, we love examples and all of that good stuff. So do you have any success stories or just any examples of what other organizations are doing to implementing employee design learning? Yeah. So we have a member organization right now who has a big strategic plan and they actually have an employee learning committee and they're working on creating career passing strategies and design programs to support employees along the way.
00:15:40:22 - 00:16:03:14UnknownSo we have net new employees and we have employees that have been doing that role for a while and employees that have transitioned into other roles so they know where the gaps were and that transition and they know what resources might have been helpful. And so they're in the midst of this right now. I'm very excited to see where this goes for them.
00:16:03:14 - 00:16:27:05UnknownIt's on their strategic initiative, which again is that leader buy in Leader said Strategically we recognize we need some supports along the career path, not just a math outline of a career path for folks. And then they empowered their h.r. Leadership team to pull together a committee of volunteer employees. So we have a group doing it right now.
00:16:27:05 - 00:17:01:05UnknownI'll be excited to see where that goes. And then i helped an organization a couple of years ago, which was a huge success story. This is very proud of this one. But it was a sales organization, an organization of its sales individuals who have been doing it for a very long time. And so one of the things I would run into with their leadership was, you know, my sales team has been selling this stuff for a really long time.
00:17:01:10 - 00:17:37:12UnknownThere's nothing they need to know. And I was like, I wonder how they think about that. So I had been tasked with identifying a progressive learning program. The plan was for new employees coming into the organization to have a up to three year progressive plan to get from kind of a lead qualifier role up to account executive. And they wanted they had to use means.
00:17:37:14 - 00:17:58:00UnknownThe problem was these were there to me every time they wanted me to do a learning thing. So we had two very burned out means who did not have a passion for development. They liked to share their expertise. They liked to be asked what do they think would work? They could spare 20 minutes for me because they were out doing the thing.
00:17:58:00 - 00:18:31:02UnknownThey liked doing the work so well intentioned people, but not with the desires that I needed. I needed people that could give me time. Because when you're talking about a three year development progressive development strategy from folks that do lead qualification and within three years they have all the tools and resources and knowledge and experience that they need to be account executives and replace folks that have been doing it for 20 plus years.
00:18:31:04 - 00:18:54:04UnknownI need more than 15 minutes of your time. So what I ended up doing was saying, can you let me you know, this is a big investment. Three years is a big investment. That also should mean time. Give me time to create something that's going to work. And let me tap on volunteers that are committed to seeing this through.
00:18:54:06 - 00:19:18:07UnknownAnd they did. They were, well, invest recognizing what they needed was the right development program. So they gave me the green light, said, Please go do this. And I had volunteers. We were multi, we were in five countries. So I had volunteers from each country ready to help because they also could we wanted to create a universal program.
00:19:18:07 - 00:19:48:04UnknownSo we didn't want it to be country specific and we wanted it to be multifaceted in the delivery modalities for the program. But we knew that, you know, what worked in Canada might be different than what worked in Scotland, which might be different than what worked in the Hawaii market. So we were all over the place in terms of expertise and experience, which was excellent because we could pull some things that folks were like, Well, I think that could work anywhere.
00:19:48:04 - 00:20:20:07UnknownLet's try that. So I had a big volunteer base, which was good because a three year program is a lot of different tools you're putting into place, right? So what we ended up doing was utilizing a sales competency model and we identified the new account acquisition Csa's knowledge, skills and abilities for that competency and account retention and growth for that competency plus some foundational everyone.
00:20:20:07 - 00:20:59:02UnknownBecause remember, we're looking at folks that are coming in that might be newer to the sales career field, being able to be account executives for enterprise sized companies with big I.T. things. So talking a lot of skills that you need. And so we were able to come up with an assessment strategy. What we did was we had all existing employees, all existing individuals in the role across all five countries take the assessment self-identifying where they felt they were strong and where they felt they could use some additional learning.
00:20:59:04 - 00:21:22:15UnknownThen we took all the universal what we saw trending across all five, and we said that is your targeted program. And we just identified kind of what was foundational was is within the first year. What is new account acquisition is in the second year what's account retention and growth. Higher level was in the third year. That was a recommendation the learning committee made.
00:21:22:17 - 00:21:53:10UnknownI wouldn't know. So I was listening to them and then we identified which things seemed to have higher numbers of individuals that have even been doing it for over 20 years, right, identifying they wanted help and said, okay, so these are intentional interactive programs versus capabilities that, you know, we didn't have a trend of a lot of folks saying they might want help in it, that we said, okay, we needed a separate group.
00:21:53:10 - 00:22:16:11UnknownWe had subcommittees within our big learning committee and we had a separate group of volunteers that were just pulling resources and we had a resource bank targeted by which capability it would fill. And we had recommended books and we had podcasts that we podcast look at that. We encourage folks to listen to and articles and blogs that they encouraged folks to subscribe to.
00:22:16:11 - 00:22:42:15UnknownSo a real resource bank for some of the less universal areas that folks were saying they needed assistance and for the foundational things that everybody was saying they needed assistance. We said there's your there's your first year development program right there. Let's build classes around this. So once we got that information, we were able to break and do even do additional volunteers.
00:22:42:15 - 00:23:10:04UnknownSome volunteers were like, I'm tapped out. I have a big project coming. I got to step off. And we had new people going, Oh, you know what? I actually would love to help design a program to build those capabilities. So we had some swapping going on and we were able to have these folks who were invigorated by this whole idea, really helping me create these great classes and these great things.
00:23:10:04 - 00:23:28:17UnknownAnd then I as the designer, right, I pulled all the materials together with them and we would have touch basis where I would say, does this exercise, is this what you were thinking? Because they were telling me what they were thinking, what they would think could work, and I would just be like, Did I structure it right? Did I explain it correctly?
00:23:28:19 - 00:23:55:16UnknownAre these the scenarios that you're thinking? So I was doing all of the behind the scenes creation of it and getting their signoff and their signoff throughout the way we met with the senior leadership stakeholders and we would get their signoff. So it became very collaborative all over the place program that my understanding I did this over three years ago is still running today.
00:23:55:18 - 00:24:39:01UnknownAnd one of the great things about the existing team members that weren't new in this career path funnel was we would we once we were done, we created the cadence of the live classes and we made sure to communicate the resources for everybody else of those things, like the podcast, the books, the blogs and things like that. And what we found was we had existing individuals who had identified that something might be an area that they could use, like voluntarily signing up for these classes that they had said they needed assistance and their colleagues had created.
00:24:39:03 - 00:25:10:00UnknownAnd then these experts who are and not that they weren't experts, I don't need to do air quotes as if they weren't these were individuals who really knew what they were doing. But the perception originally from leadership, right, was they've been doing it for 20 years. They don't need help voluntarily taking time out of their sales day, which for any sales folks listening, you now that takes a lot to step away from your sales week and attend a class that their colleagues helped design.
00:25:10:00 - 00:25:38:13UnknownSo it was it was really cool and I really liked it and it was my first time really pushing for senior leadership to have faith in their team members abilities to do this, have faith that team members that are wanting to do this are still committed to their quotas, which they were all still making because it wasn't to get out of doing their stuff.
00:25:38:13 - 00:26:05:21UnknownThat was part of the expectation that we had set. You still have to meet your sales quotas. That's still an expectation. So know that this decision isn't as an excuse me, isn't an excuse to get away for meeting your sales quotas. So we had folks that that had a passion and a desire to help. And that's the outcome you get when you have folks that really want to help build something great for their colleagues and for the next generation that will come in to these roles when they leave.
00:26:05:23 - 00:26:35:01UnknownAnd I love those examples and that's great to hear. Kind of like the step by step process that you followed and implemented to kind of create that successful employee design learning approach for this company. And it's cool to hear that it's still running today and still sound successful. So kudos to you. The length, the fear designers have when they create something and then they walk away and then they find out like a year later, Oh yeah, that ran twice.
00:26:35:01 - 00:27:08:04UnknownAnd then we had a new initiative take over. It's like it crushes your soul. Chilling. I put so much time into that. So to hear that it's still running is is very makes them very happy and well, you've mentioned we've kind of talked about how instructional design is really a crucial aspect of creating effective learning experiences. So how does involving employees in the design process influencing structural instructional design decisions for these professional development programs?
00:27:08:10 - 00:27:33:20UnknownYes, good question. The designer doesn't take a backseat, and I think that's an important clarifier to make. You're putting on a different hat for quite a bit of time. Your consulting. So you're helping. I mean, these these are individuals that very likely don't have a large adult learning theory knowledge base. So that's part of how you're helping them understand.
00:27:33:20 - 00:28:05:14UnknownSometimes folks are very lecture driven and you're like, Oh, or let's try something else. And sometimes folks want to spoon think things, spoon feed, excuse me. And so helping them understand. So we got to make sure to recognize the expertise in the room and folks have their own ideas. And so the instructional designer puts on the consultant hat for quite a bit because we also want to help educate the learning Committee on these important facets, too.
00:28:05:14 - 00:28:37:18UnknownWe help them understand when you're saying what I mean. I did a lot of work with this sales team just explaining Bloom's taxonomy objective writing and identifying. Okay, when you say that phrase, what that means is you're looking for this certain level, like a level three knowledge gain. And to do that, it means we need to put exercises in there because we need to see them do it, or you're highlighting something that means we're going to need to put in a three month touch base to check and see if they've transferred it, which is great.
00:28:37:18 - 00:29:00:15UnknownI'm not saying we don't do it, we're just helping really a lot of educating on the field to this learning employee learning committee. So that's one thing the designer does. That is sometimes designers are like, it's faster If I do it myself, I'm like, No, you're right. You are absolutely right, because you don't have to explain all of this stuff.
00:29:00:15 - 00:29:26:04UnknownBut depending on how big the program is, it might be helpful to have a group. And again, that goes to that buy in. And that at the end, is everybody as excited about it as you are? And this strategy is kind of an ounce of prevention approach. Take some time to educate and see the world after. So that's that's one thing the designer does differently.
00:29:26:06 - 00:30:03:07UnknownBut again, the designer is still ultimately building the staff. I don't send PowerPoint templates to the employee committee of a certain class. Agha And let me see what you build. You're still doing the creation, so there's still that in between. But they're helping nail down the outline again. Nail down those exercises, and you step in with that knowledge and that expertise and help make sure creativity doesn't run wild to where we're getting a way of that end goal vision, which is the strategy we're trying to help the organization achieve.
00:30:03:13 - 00:30:25:21UnknownSo we do sometimes I had some zany ideas come up from that sales group that I was like, That sounds cool. Well, I'm not quite sure what that has to do with breaking into new markets, so can we tie that together for me? And if they couldn't, I was like, then let's let's table that idea for some future, just for fun training.
00:30:25:21 - 00:30:52:23UnknownI'm not sure what we're going to do with that, but I had a hand to kind of steer the ship a lot. Yes. And what kind of talking about now, as we wrap up here, how this fits into the company's goals and strategy overall, what strategies are methods can organizations adopt to ensure that employee design learning programs align with the company's overall goals and objectives?
00:30:53:00 - 00:31:26:13UnknownYou're looking to do something like this for more future forward, and what's funny is having a group of sales leaders think about where they want to be three years from now because it, you know, it takes six, depending on, again, how big the program it could be a one time new hire class and you're just grabbing you're learning committee of folks that are on their second year of employment to help design it because you want to think as a designer strategically who are the right people for the learning committee.
00:31:26:13 - 00:31:47:17UnknownIt might not be a job role. It might be a length of time, it might be we talked in our Networking groups podcast about, you know, first year managers. So maybe that group that's now in their second year, if you're trying to figure out how to successfully own your role at this organization, you want to build a class or a program around that.
00:31:47:19 - 00:32:14:01UnknownYou're NAB and folks that are in their second year to find out what worked, what didn't, how did we help, where did we miss, what would you train folks? And so really thinking through strategically who your pool of people are and how you would want to use them for what you're thinking. But I encourage organizations think 2 to 3 years ahead, where are you trying to go?
00:32:14:03 - 00:32:46:11UnknownBecause we need to start focusing now on building the skills and capabilities to make sure your organization's talent pool has what it needs to get you there. You can't constantly think, Well, we'll hire for that. You have talent right now that is guaranteed, amazing and guaranteed ready for continuing to grow. We know engagement things. Talk about how now folks are looking to their employer to continue their career development.
00:32:46:11 - 00:33:11:00UnknownThey're not looking to do it on their own. They're looking to, you to do it for them, right? So thinking through those things is really beneficial. Asking a group of sales leaders where they think they'll be in three years, I did not know I would get met with such phases of like, I don't know. And I was like, Well, well, are we going to be selling calves or are we still going to be selling, You know, cloud based IT services?
00:33:11:00 - 00:33:32:08UnknownCan we at least figure that out? Right. So it really it was funny. But, you know, I think strategically organizations need to look long term. Where are we trying to go as an organization? Which groups are going to help us get there and what do they need to be able to do? Because because this is an investment of employee time.
00:33:32:08 - 00:33:53:15UnknownYou don't want it to be a one and done. You want to have them help build something that scalable that's replicable, that's going to be around for a few years because it's part of getting you to where you're trying to go, and then also helping the employees understand it will continue to evolve as where we're going. We'll continue to evolve.
00:33:53:15 - 00:34:16:05UnknownWe create these three year strategies as business leaders, and once you get there, it's not like, all right, high five, we can coast now. It's all right now. What's the next one? What's the next strategy? What's the next one? So something like this, since it takes time, investment is is for those types of of big kind of what do we need to empower our employees with to get us where we need to go?
00:34:16:07 - 00:34:46:03UnknownYeah, absolutely. All these as all the time we have today, unfortunately. But we're coming back with a part two on this topic. So excited about that. But thanks for all the great information you share. I think we can all walk away with some great ideas around implementing employee design, learning experiences to our listeners. If you liked our chat and topic today, I'd urge you to comment something new you learned or anything that you want to add on to this conversation.
00:34:46:03 - 00:35:10:02UnknownAny questions or any new things you're saying here? Don't forget to share this episode and of course, consider joining MRA if you aren't a member already. We've got all the resources you need in the show notes below, including resources on this topic. Otherwise, thanks for tuning into Mary and don't forget to come back for part two of this episode and we will see you next week.
00:35:10:04 - 00:35:31:06UnknownAnd that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect for more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA's 30 minutes drive so you don't miss out. Thanks. Tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

Celebrating 1 Year of 30 minute THRIVE

Description: Join us in celebrating a major milestone – our podcast's 1-year anniversary! With over 50 episodes and more than 60 incredible guest experts, it's been an unforgettable journey of learning and inspiration. We've not only shared valuable information but also had a blast along the way. To make this anniversary extra special, we've prepared a surprise – a hilarious behind-the-scenes blooper reel! 😂
If you're tuning in to this episode, we invite you to head over to our YouTube channel or visit our website to watch the blooper reel. While you're there, don't forget to sign up for updates and become a VIPP (Very Important Podcast People) by joining our mailing list. Share your topic ideas and burning questions with us too!
Thank you for being a vital part of our podcasting journey. Here's to another fantastic year ahead, filled with even more exciting content. Enjoy the bloopers! 
Resources:
30 minute THRIVE 
30 minute THRIVE YouTube Playlist 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:05UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR, powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:06 - 00:00:44:15UnknownNow it's time to thrive. We are thrilled to announce that we have reached another major milestone. We are celebrating one whole year of 30 minute Thrive. When we first had this idea. MRA really wanted to have a podcast to talk about the latest trends in HR, Share Best practices, and be a valuable resource for our members, leaders, HR
00:00:44:16 - 00:01:13:15UnknownProfessionals, trainers and more. We wanted to bring on industry experts to share their insights and experiences and provide real world solutions to everyday challenges. We wanted our listeners to walk away with practical advice. Our goal was to help our listeners thrive. And here we are one year later with over 50 episodes and have welcomed over 60 subject matter experts who joined us on the podcast.
00:01:13:17 - 00:01:44:10UnknownSo today I invite you to join us as we celebrate this special moment and look back on the incredible conversations, inspiring stories and insightful guests that we've had along the way. We could not have done it without you, our amazing listeners. We have shared so much information and have had so much fun on the podcast. So to mark this occasion, we have a little surprise for you all, a behind the scenes blooper reel.
00:01:44:12 - 00:02:12:01UnknownIf you are listening to this podcast, we invite you to watch the blooper reel on YouTube or on MRA's website. mranet.org/podcast, While you're on our website, be sure to sign up for updates and become a member of our VIPP very important podcast People list. And on that form, please let us know of any topics or questions that you would like us to cover.
00:02:12:03 - 00:02:37:02UnknownThank you once again for being a part of our podcast Journey. Here's to a fantastic next year. And enjoy the bloopers. And that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect for more podcast updates. Check out other memory episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow Emirates 30 minutes Thrive so you don't miss out.
00:02:37:03 - 00:02:41:19UnknownThanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

Inclusive Cultures, Diverse Voices: Nurturing Belonging at Work

Description: Explore the importance of belonging in the DEI movement in this 30 minute THRIVE podcast episode. Discover how it empowers individuals, amplifies voices, and enhances well-being in our diverse world. Perfect for anyone seeking insights into creating a more inclusive and equitable society.
Resources:
DEI Conference - 10/18/23 
Belonging in the Workplace: What Does It Mean and Why Does It Matter? 
Belonging: The Cornerstone of the Human Experience at Work 
Belonging Drivers & Elements 
DEI Resources for Employers 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - Denise Jamison 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Denise Jamison 
Guest Bio - Cheryl Lucas-DeBerry 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Cheryl Lucas-DeBerry 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR, powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:43:19UnknownNow it's time to thrive. All right. Well, hello, everybody, and thanks for joining us today. I'm here with and really excited to introduce to you Denise Jamison and Cheryl Lucas-DeBerry. They're both learning and development instructors here at MRA and come with a lot of great insight and expertise today on our topic. So, Denise, welcome to the show.
00:00:43:20 - 00:01:23:10UnknownI know you've never been on the podcast. And Cheryl, welcome back. Thank you. Well, these two both come with 20 plus years of experience. And Denise specifically comes with experience in presenting and facilitating really large groups around diversity, equity and inclusion strategy and implementation. And Cheryl's experience includes the development of programs and leadership, customer service and diversity. And I know that you guys do a lot more than just this, but I'm just kind of highlighting your expertise and our topic for today.
00:01:23:12 - 00:01:43:11UnknownSo I know you both are really passionate about DEI and have led a lot of successful DEI plans and initiatives. So today we're really going to be focusing on how to bring belonging a part of the DEI mix. But before we do that, I just want to kind of start out by defining what DEI truly means in the workplace.
00:01:43:11 - 00:02:13:07UnknownSo Cheryl, do you want to kick us off and kind of explain what you think DEI means when we're talking about bringing it into the workplace? Yeah, absolutely. And I. Sophie, it's great to be here, and I am. This is a topic I'm very excited about, especially including the, the piece on belonging. But just to kind of level set as diversity is kind of the multiple identities that are represented within an organization.
00:02:13:09 - 00:02:44:16UnknownInclusion is those thoughts and ideas and perspectives that each individual kind of brings to the workplace and things that actually matter for that individual. And then equity is constantly and consistently recognizing and kind of redistributing power and thinking about the whole equity piece. Equity does not mean necessarily equal. And sometimes we get a little bit confused on that.
00:02:44:20 - 00:03:11:20UnknownIt doesn't mean that we're treating everybody equally. We're giving people what they need in in the workplace. And so those are some things just to be consciously aware of. That's a great point, Cheryl. And we're seeing more of the DEI, B acronym now with belonging included in the mix. So what is belonging truly mean? I know you touched on this briefly, but you expand on that.
00:03:11:22 - 00:03:50:07UnknownYeah, I think the learning is really helping individuals bring their whole authentic selves to the workplace. And so whatever that happens to be, whomever they are, whether it's their hairstyle, whether it's part of their cultural background, all of those things, people feel like they can be themselves and bring their whole unique identity to the workplace. And I think just to add on that they can feel comfortable doing it could have something to bring your your unique self in there, but not feel like you're appreciated and welcome.
00:03:50:08 - 00:04:19:13UnknownBut the balance is kind of I feel great coming, coming to work, being who I am and kind of showing off who I am. Right. And feeling that the organization values it as well as the individuals that we work on with our in our teams. So organizational overall, but also the people that we work with. And then we have to feel as individuals have to feel comfortable bringing our unique selves to the workplace.
00:04:19:15 - 00:04:58:18UnknownYeah. Yeah, totally. Do you have anything to add on really bringing belonging into the mix and how it complements and kind of enhances the traditional DEI efforts? Sure. As Cheryl was saying earlier, with belonging, it's really bringing our whole selves to work and feeling comfortable, as you had mentioned earlier, and also being able to contribute our ideas and feel that when, when we contribute that our intelligence isn't being held in question.
00:04:58:20 - 00:05:30:22UnknownRight. Or if we ask a question, our intelligence isn't again, our intelligence isn't being called into question. Also that we can feel psychologically safe. That's that word that keeps coming up with belonging with DEI traditionally, you know, and that started back in the sixties. We were still finding this empty space and it was like, what is this emptiness?
00:05:30:22 - 00:05:58:05UnknownWhy is it why is everything not connecting? But it was that belonging piece. And to be able to ask a question, to be able to challenge an idea, to be able to bring a different perspective and feel comfortable and feel valued at, you know, in the workplace, that's where that belonging piece really fit in. To me. And so it brought everything together in that way.
00:05:58:07 - 00:06:24:10UnknownAnd another piece to add on that there is some research that I found that says that diversity, equity and inclusion really came about and thinking about it with regard to the MeToo movement and Black Lives Matter and things like that, it kind of elevated diversity, equity and inclusion. But the research also said in the I found this to be interesting.
00:06:24:12 - 00:06:49:12UnknownThe pandemic and the great resignation have also made creating that culture of belonging so critical for many organizations, not just employee well-being, but the overall well-being of the organization. So I thought that was an interesting point to make, that the pandemic has had an impact on whether people feel like they can bring their authentic selves to the workplace as well.
00:06:49:14 - 00:07:27:16UnknownOh, yeah, sure. That was an interesting point you brought up. I know we talked about it earlier, but and I think you should include the article too, and the resource I will give. So, Cheryl, why do you employers really need to incorporate belonging into the mix when you're talking about just DEI efforts in the workplace? Again, from this article that we will include in the resources, it says that if people, individuals feel like they belong, they are three times more likely to look forward to coming to work.
00:07:27:18 - 00:08:01:06UnknownThey are three times more likely to stay or to say that their workplace is a fun place to work. They are nine times more likely to believe that people are treated fairly, regardless of their race, culture, etc. And there are five times more likely to want to stay at the company. So with that great resignation, if people feel like they actually belong, they're going to be more likely to stay at an organization versus leaving.
00:08:01:08 - 00:08:32:01UnknownYou just listed a bunch of benefits. But Denise, how do you how do you really bring belonging into the workplace? So when we think about that belonging and wanting to stay at the organization and all of those wonderful statistics that you provided with just that belonging piece, when we also think about DEI and how belonging can bring everything together is with belonging, It's that your diversity belongs here, right?
00:08:32:01 - 00:09:02:19UnknownSo it doesn't matter if it's your accent, it fits your perspective, if it's your the way that you talk, the way that you dress, your diversity belongs here. Also your perspective as far as equitable practice, you know, that also belongs here in our organization. And over the pandemic, all of us had a good amount of time to kind of get to know ourselves just a little bit better, you know, just culturally, you know, as a society.
00:09:02:21 - 00:09:27:09UnknownBut when we think about the workplace, it also made us more accountable to who we were going to be and how we were going to show up. Right. And how we were going to actually create that belonging space. I know one thing that I also like to say is with belonging, it's active, right? Because belonging actually really exist in organizations today.
00:09:27:11 - 00:09:56:00UnknownBut we want to cast a wider net so that more people feel like they belong. And you hear that cultural fit you know, oh, I'm not sure if they were a cultural fit right, but it's that belonging piece that is all always, always been, been there and it's not making everyone feel like they belong. And that's where the challenge I think has been in the past.
00:09:56:02 - 00:10:35:23UnknownYeah, absolute. So we kind of discovered the importance of belonging in the workplace and kind of the benefits to it. But either of you can take this one. Can you tell us how employers can really bring this into the workplace? There are a couple of things that that organizations can do just creating that sense of belonging in the workplace is going to kind of result in higher productivity, higher engagement with all of the employees that come into the workplace and kind of building that into the overall organizational culture.
00:10:36:01 - 00:11:02:13UnknownI think is also important and just making it not just a a nice thing to do, but it's it's part of who the organization is, it's part of who we are is part of this culture that people feel comfortable in bringing their whole unique selves to the workplace. So like when we think about how we can implement it, it's all hands on deck, right?
00:11:02:13 - 00:11:28:20UnknownSo it's not just starting at the top. It's not just starting at where the employee is front line, you know, leadership. It is all hands on deck. And and that means that psychological safety. I'm going to go back to that. When someone asks a question, me as an individual, I would say great question. I'm glad you asked that.
00:11:28:20 - 00:11:57:05UnknownRight. So those are just some practices that we can put in place. And then we also want to make sure that when people come in to our workplace that they feel valued. How do we make them feel valued? We celebrate their milestones. We also invest in their their progress when they are at the organization. So what are we doing as far as Buddy systems, as far as coaching, as far as mentoring?
00:11:57:11 - 00:12:27:08UnknownWhat are we doing to invest in their education? Is is it tuition reimbursement? You know, different programs that we can offer individuals so that they actually feel valued. That's also going to make a difference with how you know, to answering the are how we can make it work. A couple other things to add on to that to the how of what organizations can do.
00:12:27:10 - 00:12:50:10UnknownOne, it's to avoid favoritism. And I know that, oh, we don't play favors. Well, do all the managers know that favoritism is not something that they should be doing? So just making sure that managers are aware of whether they are playing favorites. And all it takes is a perception, because perception is reality to the person that perceives it.
00:12:50:12 - 00:13:19:14UnknownAnd so just constantly reiterating to managers about not playing favorites or having the perception of favoritism. Another thing that organizations can do is to involve the employees in decision making. You know, just what what input do you have? What ideas do you have? Oftentimes with people who are doing the work, usually have the best ideas. We just don't always ask them in having some transparency.
00:13:19:14 - 00:13:49:24UnknownSo everybody has access to the same information, having their promotions, and as Denise said, kind of celebrating those accomplishments. We can also make sure that we're being welcoming of new employees and making sure that we are embracing the whole self and that organizations can create that sense of belonging and inclusivity, you know, kind of beyond tolerance, as we talked about earlier.
00:13:50:01 - 00:14:14:14UnknownAnd it sends the message that all employees are valued when it goes beyond tolerance, that this is just part of who we are, what this organization stands for. And it's it's real simple. You know how it starts. It starts with eye contact. Right. With just saying hello, you know, welcome. What is your name, man? I've been meeting to get to know you.
00:14:14:14 - 00:14:43:18UnknownSo tell me about yourself. You know, welcome to our team. I, you know, I'm just glad that you're here. All of that makes a huge difference. I was just going to say a lot of the ideas and advice that you just lost out. They seem like simple tasks, but it can't just be like a like Denise mentioned a one time saying it's got to be an organization wide initiative and everyone has to get comfortable doing it too.
00:14:43:18 - 00:15:15:15UnknownSo employee appreciation may sound easy, but it's got to be an all hands on deck thing where everybody is a pre and appreciating. Everybody in the managers are appreciating everybody on their team, not just one person. I'd also like to put in there that organizations need to have more persistence. Organizations need to have more grit. You know, a lot of times we hear it on the other side, you know, well, that person made it because of their grit, because of their persistence.
00:15:15:17 - 00:15:43:22UnknownAnd I think organizations I would like to invite organizations to also have that persistence and have that grit and to leaning in to making people feel like they belong because it's active. You know, it's a it's a very dynamic space where you're actually making people feel like they belong in an organization. It's that cultural piece that we tend to miss out on sometimes.
00:15:43:23 - 00:16:19:18UnknownHow about now, looking at some challenges? What are some key challenges that organizations face when integrating belonging into their DEI strategies and any advice on how to address these these challenges? Well, one thing because it's so all hands on deck, you know, it's I remember one time or I it's actually my practice. So sometimes if there's a new person that starts right, I as somebody who has been with the organization, might go and sit with that person.
00:16:19:20 - 00:16:51:09UnknownNow, sometimes the team will kind of see that like, wait a minute, what's Denise doing over there? Right. When we want to make everyone feel included. So it's that practice that everyone is going to take part in it. And it's okay. It's okay for another team member to welcome or sit next to someone who's different or, you know, we tend to sit by people who are like ourselves.
00:16:51:09 - 00:17:13:24UnknownWhy is that that affinity bias right there on the same team? They look like us, they act like us, whatever that might be. I went to the same school. But when we invite someone different and new that is making that eye contact saying hello, actually sitting next to them when they're sitting at a table that's open and no one else is sitting next to them.
00:17:13:24 - 00:17:48:20UnknownRight. And feeling okay to do that. And, you know, that takes the whole team, but it starts at an individual level. That's one way. Cheryl, any other challenges you see? Yeah, I think it also comes down to just the concept of respect and showing respect. And, you know, again, respect is in the eye of the beholder or the person who and going back to perception, but just respecting what people bring to the table different doesn't mean wrong.
00:17:48:20 - 00:18:16:12UnknownIt's just different. And if things have always stayed the same, then we would never improve. If organizations always stayed the same, they would never grow. So if you had the same kind of people, you wouldn't have a diversity, even diversity of thought. Then sometimes we think diversity means race, age, gender, etc. is all of those things, but it's also diversity of thought in people who have different backgrounds and experience.
00:18:16:12 - 00:18:51:16UnknownBring those to the workplace. And if we create an environment where they feel comfortable bringing their own backgrounds and experiences, it is going to make for a much richer organization, much richer team, and also the projects and products will be much richer for their customers. And you know, when you say respect and I just have to have to add this, all of us know the Otis Redding or the Aretha Franklin song, right, Ari, C t, what's the rest of it?
00:18:51:18 - 00:19:14:12UnknownYou got to find out what it means to me. R-E-S-P-E-C-T find out what it means to me. Right? In order for us to do that, we have to reach out and find out what it means to be people that might not sound like us or look like us, you know, and be active. And it's like I said, it's a dynamic space.
00:19:14:12 - 00:19:47:14UnknownIt's a place where we're actually constantly making people feel like they're comfortable and leaning in to that discomfort. One thing for the employees or once once we think about the creating that belonging space. So we've created a space where people can feel psychologically safe, they can challenge assumptions, they have somebody they can go to when they have those questions that they might have and might not feel comfortable sharing it on an open forum.
00:19:47:16 - 00:20:26:08UnknownWhen we provide that space where we say, Welcome, you are included, not only are you included, but you belong. The only thing that I think is the responsibility of the the new person is just to stay curious, right? So we have to keep staying curious. And that means that we feel comfortable asking questions. We feel comfortable bringing our whole selves and not feeling like we are being questioned when it comes to our integrity or our our intelligence.
00:20:26:10 - 00:20:54:07UnknownRight. All of that. So, yes, respect, I think, asking from a place of curiosity versus a place of condemn, condemning or negativity, just a place of curiosity. Tell me more about that. Tell me more about your background. Tell me more about, you know, the lunch that you're eating. Is that a cultural meal? And tell me more about your culture.
00:20:54:12 - 00:21:24:20UnknownThat is a great way to get to know people and have people feel like they belong. When you come from a place of curiosity versus I'm and, you know, being critical of you because you're different. But we want to start with the curiosity, but we also want to go back to the fact that, hey, we invited this person to be on our team because of their skills, because of their education, because of their knowledge, because of their passion.
00:21:24:24 - 00:22:03:09UnknownMaking people belong is is the precursor or just that groundwork that we create for somebody to actually do their job and do it well and bring all of their passion, their skills, their talents, their education, so that they can contribute to the organization. Right. And that's what we finally want to get to, is creating that space where you can communicate faster, where it's almost like, I don't know if either of you have played charades with two best friends, right?
00:22:03:12 - 00:22:37:06UnknownYou can never win because they have all these different ways that they can communicate with one another that is just not shared with people who might not be in there. You know, have they have shared that past history with them? So that's the advantage of having a space where you welcome diversity, where you're actually leveraging that diversity and creating that inclusive and belonging space and also in including equitable practice.
00:22:37:08 - 00:23:15:10UnknownSo making sure that everyone has equal access, as Cheryl had said earlier, making sure that we are all have the voice to share our perspectives. All of that is is important. But but the bottom line is in the workplace, we are there to be more to create more innovation, to compete at a faster rate. And the way that we can do that is by getting to know everyone who's on our teams.
00:23:15:15 - 00:24:10:20UnknownSo you both shared some great real life examples of how organizations are implement doing belonging initiatives in their organizations. But do you have any other examples or maybe you know, of an organization who's doing a certain thing that you can share with us on how they're really leveraging belonging to strengthen their DEI efforts? I have made example of an organization that has created a senior leadership mentoring program, and I think it's important that senior leaders are involved in this and so that they are then paired up with a new employee so that that employee learns from the expertise of that senior leader, but also the senior leader can learn some things about that individual because
00:24:10:23 - 00:24:43:06Unknownnone of these practices, none of these initiatives will work as effectively as they could if it does not start with senior leadership. Senior leadership is not involved. That's not embrace these initiatives, does not ensure that the initiatives are cascaded down throughout the organization. Then it doesn't work as well. We can do a lot of great things on the ground level, but if it doesn't go up the ladder and if it doesn't cascade down, then it's not going to be as effective.
00:24:43:06 - 00:25:09:10UnknownSo having that senior leadership mentor program goes a long way in that person, feel committed to the organization, feels like the organization is committed to them because that senior leader is taking time out of their schedule to mentor them, but also that individual, that new employee is learning from the senior leader about their skills, but also about the organization overall.
00:25:09:12 - 00:25:55:06UnknownYou know, another thing is affinity groups. I have a lot of respect for affinity groups. The reason being is that it gives people who might not have the opportunity to be in leadership or show leadership, the opportunity to show leadership. You can be responsible for budget, you can organize a meeting throughout the organization, and all of these efforts help people who might not normally be seen, get seen and make those connections and build those relationships so that you can learn more about the organization and just how your organization in particular works and functions.
00:25:55:08 - 00:26:34:16UnknownSo that would be one that I would really encourage. So how can individuals then really start to become allies in advocates for belonging and supporting those who may feel excluded or that they don't belong in in this kind of setting? Any advice for that? Well, with individually, I think that being curious about different cultures, also learning about people who might be different, learning a different language, right.
00:26:34:16 - 00:27:17:08UnknownThat even opens your mind to different perspectives. So when we think about language in and of itself, some languages have one word that would be a masculine and another language that it might be feminine, right? So when we just think about learning a new language, eating a new type of food, going to a movie that's in a different language, all of this helps us understand that there are different people that come to our organizations with different perspectives, different cultures, a different upbringing, and how important it is to the growth of our organization.
00:27:17:10 - 00:27:43:16UnknownCheryl, anything to add on this? Yeah, I think just again, that that curiosity, but just inviting people to join your your group or if your group is like, no, we don't want to to deal with that, you reach out to that person and say, Hey, just wanted to. Why don't we get together and go to lunch? Why don't we get together and have coffee or whatever?
00:27:43:16 - 00:28:20:24UnknownAnd just to get to know that person on an individual basis is going to help want them in. So you want to model the behavior that others will see, that you're doing something positive, you're not doing it because you're obligated to do it. You're doing it because it is the right thing to do and to make sure that everybody feels included and feels like they belong at the organization and feel like they can bring their authentic selves and show who they really are and not have to feel like they have to wear mask when they come to work that they can be their authentic selves.
00:28:21:01 - 00:29:08:07UnknownYes, So often as a people who are in the minority, we come to a workplace and the first thing we in the back of our heads is what do I have to give up? Or what is it that I have to minimize about myself so that I can be a part of this organization, but instead of spending time wondering about what I need to give up, what I need to minimize to be able to just come to work and do my job and be able to contribute everything that I have, all of the education that I that I've had over the course of all my years, all of the skills that I have to bring
00:29:08:12 - 00:29:47:14Unknownto be able to bring everything that I have and concentrate on that and just build relationships, ask questions, challenge ideas, bring new ideas to the fold. That's where we can really experience that richness, that diversity, equity, inclusion and belonging is there to help organizations thrive. And I love that word. 30 minute Thrive. Yeah, right. You both brought up just the importance of just reaching out and including people in your organization.
00:29:47:16 - 00:30:13:20UnknownAnd actually just last week, just for an example, one of our coworkers stopped by my desk and was like, Hey, I'm volunteering with a group of people next week. Like, I'd love I'd love for you to join. Are you available? And I was available, but and to another point, it made me feel really good that she came and reached out and it was a group that I didn't really do a lot with at work.
00:30:13:22 - 00:30:51:24UnknownSo it just made me feel really good about myself and come over and include me with a group that I'm not too familiar with and I got to get to know that group, which makes me feel better about just my coworkers and who I'm working with and stuff like that. So it can be just as simple as inviting your coworker to go volunteer with you and think about all the new people that you're going to meet, all the different perspectives that you're going to get and you, if you build it, you believe or you begin to trust their ideas and you feel like they'll trust you, you know?
00:30:52:01 - 00:31:30:05UnknownAnd so just as we wrap up here is our times are up and up. What are some of the most critical takeaways for listeners to remember when adding belonging into the dynamics in their own lives and in their organization? I think just making sure that people feel feel comfortable bringing their host also to the workplace, whatever is unique about that individual that they don't feel like they have to hide it or they don't feel like they have to minimize it, as Denise was saying, but they can bring their whole selves.
00:31:30:05 - 00:32:04:22UnknownWhatever makes you makes you you that I can bring that to the workplace. There is a great quote that we talked about with diversity, equity, inclusion and belonging. In a sense that diversity is being invited to the party. Inclusion is being asked to dance by belonging is dancing like nobody's watching. And if I can dance like nobody's watching at work, then I am being my authentic self.
00:32:04:24 - 00:32:38:10UnknownTotally. Yes, I love that. Denise, any other key takeaways as we wrap up today? One thing that I would just like to remind organizations is that D and B is great business strategy, so it helps teams function smoothly. It also helps departments work closer together and be more innovative and be more creative and compete and keep up with what's happening in the world.
00:32:38:10 - 00:33:09:15UnknownAnd our our world is just changing at such a quick and fast rate, especially when we think of competitiveness globally. DEI helps include different perspectives, quickly make those relationships so that we can build trust and create more dynamic teams and systems so that we can compete. So great, great takeaways from Cheryl and Denise Sink you. Thank you again for all the great information you shared today.
00:33:09:19 - 00:33:37:14UnknownI think we can all walk away with some some great ideas around implementing belonging into our DEI efforts. To our listeners, if you liked our chat and topic today, I would just urge you to comment something new you learned today or anything that you want to add on to this conversation. We're always open to hear your thoughts and your suggestions and advice to Don't forget to share out this episode and consider joining MRA if you aren't a member already.
00:33:37:19 - 00:33:59:01UnknownWe have all the resources you need in the show Notes below, including resources on this topic with article Cheryl was talking about otherwise. Thank you so much for tuning in today and we will see you next week. Thanks everyone. Thanks for having me, Sophie. Thank you. And that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect.
00:33:59:01 - 00:34:14:05UnknownFor more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA’s 30 minute Thrive so you don't miss out. Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

Executive Insights: August Talent Report

Description: In this episode, we’ll explore the August edition of MRA's monthly Talent Report: Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion.
We’ll hear from Jim Morgan, Vice President of Workforce Strategies, on best practices, including:
Attracting the next generation of customers and staff
Employee engagement and experience
Recruiting and the candidate experience
AI platforms
Implementing company-wide DEI initiatives 
Uncover C-Suite priorities, top creative HR strategies, and more!
Resources:
August Talent Report 
Talent Report+ Webinar Series 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - Jim Morgan 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Jim Morgan 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:41:24UnknownNow it's time to thrive. All right. Well, welcome, everybody, to this episode of 30 Minute Thrive. I'm excited to go over this month's talent report with Jim Morgan, MRA. Vice president of Workforce Strategies, as we go into what he's been seeing in the world of business in the month of August. So thanks for joining us again this month, Jim.
00:00:42:01 - 00:01:08:16UnknownAlways a pleasure to come back. Well, for August, it looks like the special topic was on diversity, equity and inclusion, specifically working on efforts in organizations. So why did you choose this DEI topic for this month? Well, I think, you know, it's a topic that we could probably do just about any month, and we hadn't done it yet this year on the talent report, and that now would be a good time.
00:01:08:16 - 00:01:32:19UnknownAnd with the talent shortage and what we've talked about the last six or seven episodes, all of the issues around diversity, equity, inclusion also play into the talent pool as well. And we know what are companies doing in order to to figure that out. And so, Diana, what we brought in from our Ohio office talked about and we talked a little bit more a little bit later about the results.
00:01:32:19 - 00:02:15:13UnknownBut, you know, she started by talking about, you know, why are we doing this in the first place? And we had just done a survey of our Chief Diversity Officers roundtable. And that's sort of what drove this month's topic. And she had brought to it. Well, you know, here's what they were saying were the reasons that they had a DEA program in their company to build stronger teams, to foster collaboration, to make employees feel valued, to enhance productivity, to create a welcoming environment, to build trust among employers, to attract top talent, to increase retention, to increase business development, and to ensure the production of new ideas.
00:02:15:15 - 00:02:38:24UnknownSo that list of ten, I thought, well, okay, well, people aren't interested in those ten things and we're really in trouble. So that's kind of what we focused on, was sort of yea, the positives that come out of that, and especially in terms of engaging and retaining. And I can talk a little bit about our elite program here at Amara, but really it's it's just a strategy that I think almost every company is utilizing now.
00:02:39:00 - 00:03:06:15UnknownWe're just trying to help them see some of the best practices that are out there. Yeah, that was a great list of benefits that you just talked about. And this episode will kind of be a good leeway in to our next week's episode. After this, we're talking about how belonging fits into the diversity, equity and inclusion mix. So understanding that one, yeah, let's kind of go into what's happening in recruiting and retention world.
00:03:06:15 - 00:03:36:18UnknownSo Jim, what's what are you seeing here that's new? We were wrapping up our internal leadership program, of which you are a proud graduate and we were asking, you know, what are you doing in some of your wrap up things? And we got some really neat ideas from the coordinators around kind of their year end projects. And they shared with us that one of them had their interns look in their own department as to how do they attract the next generation of customers and employees.
00:03:36:20 - 00:03:59:14UnknownAnd so depending on what department they were in, they were providing their perspectives on how do we go out and engage 20, 21, 22 or 23 year olds. So that was one of their their projects. Another company had them look at the entire employee cycle of life and basically say, What is our candidate experience look like? What's our onboarding experience look like?
00:03:59:16 - 00:04:21:22UnknownWhere does our experienced employee experience look like? And so they reported back on conversations that they had with employees at a variety of different places in that in that cycle, one of the groups developed a campus recruiting strategy for the company so that when they go out next year, they've kind of got the playbook and what it's going to take to go.
00:04:21:23 - 00:04:44:23UnknownWe we recruit people. One put together a social media plan for, you know, how do we go out and recruit. And then most of them were presenting their material to the executive staff, which really I think was a real bonus for the kids that were the interns in the program. It gave them a chance, you know, to have some exposure in front of those people.
00:04:45:00 - 00:05:02:12UnknownAnd I think exempt were from everything that we got back. We're pretty excited about the fact that while these are, you know, some of the ideas might be out there a little bit but it's a fresh set of eyes looking at what does this mean for a 20, 21, 22 year old. So really kind of a cool wrap up to the season.
00:05:02:12 - 00:05:23:10UnknownAnd I think with a lot of the the interns that we had. Yeah, absolutely. And I just have to mention because I just saw this on LinkedIn, but was Emory's interim leadership program with our intern grads, we gave them a little interim leadership badge to put on their own personal LinkedIn accounts and they can post it as an accomplishment.
00:05:23:10 - 00:05:48:13UnknownAnd that also just kind of gets the word out and creates creates our own little intern program advocates and kind of in a fun way to. Yeah. So that was that was pretty exciting. On the intern side, we've also seen, you know, we're talking about salaries and things and the companies aren't in quite the same hiring mode that they were, but they're still looking for those critical positions.
00:05:48:19 - 00:06:14:11UnknownBut the pressure on salaries remains there. People coming in asking for more money than some of the experienced people in that same position. So that continues to be an issue, I think, for employers trying to help people understand what the market actually is. And just because, you know, your cousin made this much out in California, doing something doesn't mean you're going to make that much in Green Bay doing the same thing.
00:06:14:13 - 00:06:41:07UnknownSo they're continuing to try to educate, I think, their employees on on market value and things like that. The people wanting the remote worker mode remains a big deal. And we just keep hearing stories. This one came from an I.T. company that was just having a hard time finding computer technology folks because they were requiring them to come in and finally just said, we'll let them work fully remote.
00:06:41:07 - 00:07:16:08UnknownAnd we're surprised at the increase in number and quality of the people that they were starting to get in. And that doesn't apply to every job. But again, people that are in the I.T. business might have already had some experience working remote, and that seems to be something that they're they're very interested in. And then lastly, seeing more of a push right now and candidates asking for more leads, whether that's family leave or paid sick time or vacation, that, yes, everybody still wants more money, but the lead time is coming into play.
00:07:16:08 - 00:07:34:21UnknownAnd I think it's one it's a work life balance thing for a lot of people as they come in. But two, you've got folks now that are taking care of elderly parents. They're trying to figure out child care issues. You know, they're kind of stuck in the middle of taking care of both the the people that raise them and the people that they're raising.
00:07:34:23 - 00:07:58:15UnknownAnd so I think that's putting a little more pressure on employers as well. You know, anything else in the thinking section just kind of goes along with the recruiting and candidate process. But I know you talked about recruiters being more involved with their hiring managers and actually shadowing the position that they're recruiting for. Can you expand on that a little bit?
00:07:58:17 - 00:08:17:22UnknownYeah, You know, I think the people in h.r. Have been pushing for this for quite some time because, one, i can't do it alone. And two, you're the hiring manager, you know, a little bit more about, you know, what's happening in the position. So I think you're seeing a lot more teamwork between the two. I think the hiring managers have begun to understand what the h.r.
00:08:17:22 - 00:08:38:20UnknownFolks are facing in terms of trying to find good candidates. I think they're buying into the process a little bit more and i think it takes a little bit of the pressure off the human resources people to, you know, basically do everything, but it also engages the hiring manager and the process to it rather than after you've gone through the entire process and said, here's your person.
00:08:38:20 - 00:08:59:17UnknownThey're like, this isn't what I'm looking for. You can find that out a lot earlier, that this is not the skill set or the person will know it right away versus after having them interview and come in and and do the rest of it. So I think that partnership is really sort of helping, helping us find even better people and probably find them a little bit faster as well.
00:08:59:19 - 00:09:21:10UnknownWe also, in connection with that paid time off, there was a Georgetown University survey that came out that said the flexible work schedule is right up there, along with paid time off as the two things that young adults are asking for more than anything else. I don't know that that's really different. You know, I'm guessing when I went in for my first job, I sure I said, how much does this pay?
00:09:21:10 - 00:09:41:00UnknownHow many days off do I get and what's the work schedule? But I think it's just there's more of an openness now to bring it up and have that have that discussion. And like I said, the salary issue, you know, there's a lot of data out there and I think people can look up, Oh, I'm an electrical engineer, how much should I get paid?
00:09:41:02 - 00:10:07:17UnknownAnd depending on what sorts you get, all kinds of things come out. Second of all, you talk to your cousin and they say, Oh, I made this much. So you take that and your generation, more than mine, shares information on social media a lot more openly than people did 30 or 40 years ago. And I think we had just as human nature, we have a tendency to find the highest number that anyone shared and said that must be the starting salary.
00:10:07:19 - 00:10:31:17UnknownSo employees and candidates, I think, are coming in with what they think is here's my data and it all says 80,000 and then meeting up with the employer that says, Well, here's our benchmark survey and it says 60,000. And so we're having some tough conversations, I think. But, you know, it is what it is. People have some information and at least gives you a place to start from and have the conversation for sure.
00:10:31:19 - 00:11:06:21UnknownBut we always talk about employee engagement in our talent report conversations. And this month you stated that 31% of us employees are thriving at work or are very engaged where 52% are quite quitting or not engaged in. 17% are actually wild quitting or actively disengaged. So my question is, what do you do with these three different groups? Well, all of this data came from Gallup, and they are well known for their employee engagement surveys and do literally hundreds of thousands of individuals.
00:11:06:21 - 00:11:26:07UnknownSo it's a pretty good database that they can pull from. But yeah, those were those were the results. And, you know, you look at that and you're like, holy smokes, you know, what do I do with this? And, you know, Gallup's advice out of all this was, okay, first of all, you've got more than half of them. They're quiet, quitting, not engaged category to them.
00:11:26:07 - 00:11:46:09UnknownThat's the low hanging fruit. You know, these are people are still showing up. They're not disruptive. They're they're working. And they're probably the group that would be the easiest to sort of push into that engaged group if we figure out what it is. Well, you know, what's missing is it camaraderie? Is it you know, you're feeling like you're independent.
00:11:46:11 - 00:12:15:02UnknownIs it more social activities? Like, you know what? Why don't you feel engaged? And if we can find that, we can probably push that group, maybe some of that 52 into the 31, the people that are actually, you know, engaged and thriving at work. The second suggestion comes even from those people that are engaged, you know, are they really, you know, like you've got that group of people that you can send them out on the street to sell the organization no matter who it was to?
00:12:15:04 - 00:12:37:21UnknownAnd how do you maybe get some of that group that's already engaged, but to that really engaged group? And is there a little bit something special that these are our high performers. These are people that are getting the work done. Can we give them another nudge? And yeah, they'll still be in the same category, but they'll be even bigger zealots, I guess, you know, and advocates for your for your organization.
00:12:37:23 - 00:13:09:17UnknownAnd then a little bit of, you know, okay, if you've got people that are loud quitting, which was their term, which basically is now, you know, and not engaged, I'm telling people I'm not engaged and I'm posting things that say I'm not engaged. That's a group that can do some damage. And so with that group, it may be, okay, let's bring you in and find out, can we move you into someone that you know is satisfied with their job, at least not actively out there, you know, saying bad things about stuff?
00:13:09:19 - 00:13:31:19UnknownOr is it someone who just is a bad fit for the organization and we have to deal with it that way. So I think, you know, if you go from top to bottom, take those really good engaged people and make them even more engaged. Take the group that's not engaged but is just kind of on the fence and try to move them to those that are thriving and for those that are, you know, actively sabotaging.
00:13:31:19 - 00:14:06:04UnknownAnd almost we either got to get them under the tent or help them find a different tent in which to play under. And so there's work for all groups, basically across groups. Everybody can move up a notch. I think actually we're kind of moving into more of our tech talk. Last month we talked about how AI is just continuing to grow every second of the day, which means that companies are figuring out how to use it and how to incorporate that in AI into their work, in their day to day responsibilities.
00:14:06:06 - 00:14:35:07UnknownSo any new updates this month on how AI platforms are being used in in work today? Yeah, I just got done doing a seminar with folks that were utilizing it and recruiting and it's fascinating. And all of this that I'm about to tell you came from the part of Chat GPT that you actually have to pay for, which you know, I knew there was the free part that I've used and then there's the paper and I thought, Well, I'm getting what I need from the free part.
00:14:35:13 - 00:14:56:05UnknownBut now having seen the part that you can pay for, it does even a heck of a lot more. But they just gave examples of things that were real, I guess just time savers writing a job description. You know, you can feed in. This is what it is. This is what we're talking about and get an awful lot of information back.
00:14:56:07 - 00:15:15:03UnknownGive me 12 really good interview questions and they can come back with a whole bite, you know, save you the time of trying to figure out, you know, what are we going to ask this type of job? There was one sample where they took a very complicated job. It was some sort of engineer, and I wouldn't have understood what they did.
00:15:15:05 - 00:15:38:23UnknownAnd the question that they actually asked of Chad GPT was explain a whatever a nuclear engineer to me. Like I'm 12 years old and you know, the h.r. Person said he just gave me a better idea of. Okay, i understand now seeing all these big words over here, but now i know what they actually do. So in terms of writing it, I've got a much better idea of what it is I should be talking about.
00:15:39:00 - 00:15:59:04UnknownAnd then even, you know, saying, what are 12 good lunch and learn topics that we can share with all of our employees, you know, and you get a list back not only of the 12, but with some bullet points underneath that say you might want to touch on this and this and this and this. So it was really it was really interesting to see the things that could generate that were really time savers.
00:15:59:06 - 00:16:19:24UnknownAll of this comes with a caveat that says don't just take it and put it out there, take it and read it because funky things can happen because this is, you know, this is machine learning. This is a language that is looking for, you know, and pulling out our chat. GB t it basically stop taking in new data in September of 2021.
00:16:20:01 - 00:16:44:20UnknownSo if you're looking for something that's up to date, you're not going to get the latest and the greatest, at least from that platform. But when you're asking for questions like what are good topics, what are good questions, you know, missing out on the last two years probably doesn't make a whole lot of difference. And then I think the most interesting quote I heard during the whole webinar was, you know, people are afraid that AI is going to come and take their job.
00:16:44:22 - 00:17:08:12UnknownAnd the person's response was, A.I. is not going to take your job, but someone who knows I might and they're simply saying this is another tool. This is now you know how the Excel and PowerPoint and Word are basic skills. Now, PDFs are basic skills now, and knowing something about A.I. is going to become a basic skill is basically the point that she was making.
00:17:08:14 - 00:17:40:21UnknownAnd I've also heard that it's like we all know it's it's never going to go away. So the businesses that figure out how to incorporate it and use it successfully are going to be the businesses that come out successful all through A.I.. Yeah. So Diana Small, our executive director of Emory Emory's Ohio division, Like we said, she also made an appearance on this month's report talking about implementing DEI strategies and efforts into organizations.
00:17:40:23 - 00:18:03:09UnknownSo you talked a little bit about the why, but do you have any other key points or takeaways that Diana mentioned that you want to highlight today? Yeah, When we got done, I just said, you know, and she walked through the beginner and intermediate advanced and everything that was was going on there and people can see the recording of that if they want to go look at the talent report.
00:18:03:11 - 00:18:23:04UnknownBut I just said to her, you know, I said, you've done enough of this just at a gut level, what what has to be in place in order for someone to be successful in putting a DEI program in place? And she said really two things. You know, one, you've got to have a culture that's ready to accepted employees that are willing to engage and want to be a part of it.
00:18:23:06 - 00:18:47:10UnknownAnd two, you've got to have leadership buy in. And, you know, that sounds so simple, but, you know, you can just see how things will move faster if you're not trying to overcome your leadership team, but you're being driven by your leadership team that makes such a difference. And then if you find people that are really engaged in this and are passionate about it, that really changes the game too.
00:18:47:12 - 00:19:10:08UnknownAnd that, you know, I shared with her, you know, our employee resource group here is called I Lead at MRA and I'm a part of that and about 40 other people are. And it's really our place to go have these deep discussions. And I said to her, I said, That makes complete sense to me, because the people that come into those meetings are passionate about, you know, how do we make sure that we're diverse and equitable?
00:19:10:08 - 00:19:36:07UnknownI include people and there's a sense of belonging, and people really are very open and honest, sharing their own stories. Here's what they're seeing, here's what they're hearing. And then what do we as a group of employees do to reach out and engage even more of our employees? And so I thought, as simple as you, when you say culture and leadership, it, when you think about it, if those two things aren't in play, boy, then you really got your work cut out for.
00:19:36:07 - 00:19:51:13UnknownSo I just thought you did a really nice job of breaking it down to that point and saying, you know, look, you got to you've got to set the place up to be ready for it and you've got to have the leaders that are willing to lead on it. So it was succinct and simple and but a big deal if you don't have it.
00:19:51:15 - 00:20:18:22UnknownYeah, absolutely. I would just reiterate to make sure to tune in to next week's episode. If you do want to learn more about implementing DEI strategy in your organization and how belonging should send to mix. But just as we kind of wrap up here, we've got another chart question, and I know you included the chart at the end of the Taylor Report, and it shows the working age population annual growth rate.
00:20:18:24 - 00:20:43:18UnknownSo what does this chart shows or anything that we should necessarily be scared of when we're looking at it? I think you're doing this to me on purpose, that you're trying to have me. Okay, let's see. And how many words can you describe this chart? So I'm just going to put it on the website. You can go look at it now if you want to see what the chart is, Is it the working age population annual growth rate?
00:20:43:20 - 00:21:21:04UnknownSo how much is it growing each year? And it goes from 1960 predicted through 2050, and it's got ten different countries, continents, areas of the united of the world on there, North America, Africa, Russia, West Europe, Japan, China. So you're getting a look at basically the whole world and what exactly is going on there. And the simplest thing I can say is the chart from 1960 to 19 8085 looks like you're climbing up the ladder to a to go down the ski slope, I guess.
00:21:21:06 - 00:21:48:06UnknownAnd when you hit about 1980, 1985, you basically go down the slope and it's for every single country that's in the group, some more severe than others. But you have countries that are dropping below, you know, the 0%. I mean, they're actually getting smaller, which includes North America, it includes Russia, it includes Western Europe. You know, so this isn't just a United States problem.
00:21:48:06 - 00:22:11:19UnknownIt's sort of an all over the place problem. But even the countries that are staying above and are the ones that you think of the fast growing like, you know, Africa, they're starting you know, by the time you get to 2030, you're starting to see a drop off there. So it's a universal thing. And the point we're trying to make with that is this is happening everywhere, maybe for different reasons in different places.
00:22:11:21 - 00:22:31:10UnknownBut as people are thinking, oh, well, I'll just go to where the people are, they might be having the exact same problem that we're having in the United States. And so as people are trying to figure out, if I can't do it here, how do I outsource? Where do I go? It was just sort of take a look around the world because you can see that other people are going to be facing the same problem, too.
00:22:31:12 - 00:22:52:03UnknownSo that chart is I know it's in the tail report that's on the tail report website and maybe we can put it up on the podcast site as well. Yeah, absolutely. Well, you did a good job of describing it. Thank you. Just think of the up and down. Yeah, well, as we wrap up here, can you give us a sneak peek on what September's talent report will be?
00:22:52:05 - 00:23:13:01UnknownYeah, it's going to be about compensation and compensation trends. We've got our big comp trends event in September. And just as another plug, we've got our Big D conference coming up in October. So I would encourage everybody to go to the MRA website and take a look at both of those. But we're not going to share all the comp trends data because that's coming out a couple of weeks.
00:23:13:01 - 00:23:33:07UnknownWe won't have the final information, but we are going to have some trends of what people we may not have the specific data for 2023, but we will be talking about some of the things that people are starting to look at and as the teaser, I guess for for for next month that we're sort of at this generational tipping point.
00:23:33:13 - 00:23:57:15UnknownWe're at the point now where the workplace is about 50% millennials and Gen Zs and 50% Gen Xers and Baby boomers. And if you think about the Xers in the Boomers, and then you think about the Millennials and the Zs, they want different things. And so when you start talking about benefits, not just because they're in different age groups, which does drive a lot of it, but they are very different lifestyles too.
00:23:57:15 - 00:24:19:01UnknownAnd so now how are companies going to figure out their total compensation practice when these this group of people might be looking for things that isn't what we're offering right now, but we still have to offer them for this group until they retire. And I think it's going to it's going to be an interesting sort of tipping point as we go from one to the other.
00:24:19:03 - 00:24:47:23UnknownAnd we'll have some thoughts on that in September. Yeah, sounds like a great topic and a great leeway into the terms about. Yeah, but Jim, thank you for all your great information today and kind of recapping what you've been saying in business with an emphasis on talent for August. So to our listeners, if you liked our chat and topic today, I'd urge you to comment something new that you learned today or any current trends or topics that you've really been seeing in the h.r.
00:24:47:23 - 00:25:09:03UnknownWorld. Don't forget to share this episode and consider joining mra. If you aren't a member already. Like always, we have all the resources you need in the show notes below, including jim's resources on the talent report plus. Thank you so much for tuning in today. And we will see you next week. And that wraps up our content for this episode.
00:25:09:04 - 00:25:27:11UnknownBe sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect for more podcast updates. Check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA’s 30 minutes Thrive so you don't miss out. Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.
 

Social Media as a Recruiting Tool

Description: Explore the role of social media in modern recruitment on this episode of 30-minute THRIVE. Discover how leading companies harness LinkedIn, X, Facebook, Instagram and more to attract top talent. Learn about effective job postings, employer branding, and hear from an experienced recruiter about current trends and best practices. Whether you're a hiring manager, recruiter, in HR, or job seeker, tune in to elevate your recruitment strategy and find the best talent for success.
Resources:
How Technology Can Help - The Recruiter's Role 
MRA Membership 
About MRA 
Let's Connect:
Guest Bio - Kathy Seidel 
Guest LinkedIn Profile - Kathy Seidel 
Host Bio - Sophie Boler 
Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler 
Transcript:
Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:21:03UnknownHello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR, powered by MRA, the Management Association looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler, and we are so glad you're here.
00:00:21:05 - 00:00:41:23UnknownNow it's time to thrive. Hello, everybody, and welcome to this episode of 30 Minute Thrive. And welcome back, Kathy. Thanks for having me. Kathy is our manager of recruiting services here at Emory. For those of you who haven't got Kathy yet. And today will be looking at the fascinating world of social media and how that AIDS as a recruitment tool.
00:00:42:00 - 00:01:09:12UnknownSo we'll really be checking out all of the innovative ways that top companies are leveraging platforms like LinkedIn, Twitter, Instagram to find and attract the best talent out there. So, Kathy, let's start out with talking about how social media has really changed the way companies recruit talent nowadays. So what are your thoughts on this? Yeah, so, you know, I think like everything else in our lives, social media has really changed the way that we work and the way that we live.
00:01:09:14 - 00:01:38:24UnknownThere's so many different ways that you can find people, find information, get their contact information, communicate with them. And, you know, that's the same thing on the company side for interested candidates. There's so many ways they can see things about you learn about different opportunities within your organization and then also get in touch with you. And so you've really got to be prepared for, you know, what different ways people can look at you or talk to you and make sure that you're kind of leveraging all the tools that you can.
00:01:39:03 - 00:02:03:03UnknownGreat point. Kind of piggybacking off of that, what are some some of the benefits that social media has to really find and attract these this talent? Yeah. Yeah. So social media, you know, can be really useful for getting a lot of information out there, but you have to be careful how you do that. And you don't want to flood a feed every day with, you know, here's all the reasons to work for us.
00:02:03:03 - 00:02:29:06UnknownHere's all of our jobs that are posted, anything like that. You want to really make sure that you're focused and doing careful efforts, much like marketing. I really see recruitment marketing as its own special kind of subsection of recruitment. So how are you making sure that you're getting the word out there and saying all the right things? Again, a great benefit is the fact that you don't have to go out and find people cruising with the way algorithms are.
00:02:29:07 - 00:02:53:19UnknownYou can put content out there and it can get in front of people who might not be connected to your brand and get them excited about it in a way that they haven't been before. But let's be real. No one knows how algorithms work for us. So there is definitely times where you're like shooting in the dark and just like, let's see if it works, but it's working with, you know, your marketing team to figure out how you can kind of make that best shot.
00:02:53:19 - 00:03:20:23UnknownMaybe put a little bit of a flashlight on and see where you're going. Oh, absolutely. Kind of looking at the other side of this now, what are some common mistakes that companies make? One, using social media for recruiting? Yeah, So a couple of things. Number one is, you know, posting too much online once it's really easy to just go, I'm going to post, check out our jobs and a link every day or, you know, every Monday or whatever.
00:03:21:03 - 00:03:44:05UnknownAnd that is not good for the algorithms. It recognizes that that's the same content over and over and over. And so you want to kind of make sure that you're putting some variety in there. It's also really important to take a look at what your following is before you get started, because if your company Facebook page is all current employees, right, they're not going to care about jobs that are currently posted.
00:03:44:07 - 00:04:05:01UnknownYou know, they might want to hear more about referral opportunities or growth opportunities if you want to try to grow that following, you know, you have to do different things to engage different people. Same thing. If you're following our customers, you don't necessarily want to only be posting jobs that you have open to your customers because you might get accused poaching their employee.
00:04:05:03 - 00:04:24:07UnknownSo, you know, it's really making sure that you're tailoring that content to your existing following and then separately focusing on how we can grow that following with different things. Yeah. You know, you see a lot of companies that will try to do things to grow that following that ends up being kind of inauthentic or not aligned with their brand.
00:04:24:09 - 00:04:44:13UnknownYou and I were talking the other day about we've seen some companies on TikTok that start these like one off like segment things that aren't related to their company at all. And they continue on because they end up getting, you know, a following for it, but it doesn't have anything to do with their company. And so that it becomes like, do we continue this because it costs money to continue it?
00:04:44:15 - 00:05:06:16UnknownHigh, whatever it might be, but it doesn't align with what we do. And then when you stop doing it, you get huge pushback. You lose a bunch followers, and then there's that negative kind of impact. So you have to make sure what you're doing, alliance to what your company does or what your followers want, because otherwise it's just going to end up kind of failing on you.
00:05:06:19 - 00:05:37:03UnknownYeah, And going off of that point, what social media platforms are really the most effective for recruiting and why are they the most effective? Yeah, so I would definitely say LinkedIn is one of the most effective. Obviously it's more of a professional focused website anyways, but they've also got some really interesting tools as part of it. Number one, there are different tools that you can use to kind of schedule those posts, though it doesn't have to be that you take an hour out of your day to make a post to get it live.
00:05:37:03 - 00:06:02:13UnknownAm I doing it at the right time or not? You can use those tools to schedule it. Sometimes those tools you can pay that they'll post it at the perfect time, so to speak. But LinkedIn also has a newer feature where talent can indicate that they're interested in your brand right on your company page. And then if you have a LinkedIn recruiter or if you're using LinkedIn job slots, they'll highlight that this person is interested in your brand.
00:06:02:15 - 00:06:22:24UnknownSo that's really awesome because I love your talent. Yeah, we were looking at some of those stats and it's it's crazy, You know, how easy it is for people to then say maybe there's not a job out there right now for them, but hey, in the future there might be one on the candidate side. They then get a notification anytime you post a new job on LinkedIn.
00:06:23:01 - 00:06:44:01UnknownSo like I said, if there's not a job that's open for them right now, they'll get pushes from LinkedIn to say, Hey, this company now has this job open, does this, and you let's talk about it. LinkedIn is also great for that reach out. You know, it's kind of easy to find people who work in that organization. You can kind of put together who would be the right person to reach out to for this.
00:06:44:01 - 00:07:10:22UnknownAnd then they have the messaging platform. So that's always really great. You know, Facebook, I do think, is helpful. It is an interesting site, you know, in terms of who uses it and who doesn't. But it is still helpful to have that information out there. Again, it's about looking at what your following already is online. Is it all employees or is it all, you know, people who might be interested kind of taking a look at that?
00:07:10:24 - 00:07:37:03UnknownI will say Instagram Tik tok. You know those I don't see as much success with. You can do ads and that's great. But if it's not something that's authentic to your brand, it's really easy for people to spot. And you know, and that's the case in marketing too. If it's not something that makes sense. The only time it works is if your scrub daddy, because they do, you know, that they're just trying to make viral videos and it works.
00:07:37:05 - 00:08:02:04UnknownBut they're also not using it for recruiting. They're using it to sell sponges, great sponges. Yeah. I would I would kind of also echo that and just say it. It just depends where your target audience is. So where are you most likely to find a candidate for the position you're posting? And also like Tic TAC, like you said, are you going to find prospective candidates on TikTok?
00:08:02:04 - 00:08:26:05UnknownMaybe. But should you rely on just TikTok or the smaller platforms? Instagram? Probably not. But yeah, those are all good points that you said. Yeah. Yeah. So would it be enough to just post on like Facebook jobs or just posts on LinkedIn or just kind of put all your eggs in one basket? I always say try and spread it out.
00:08:26:07 - 00:08:55:11UnknownYou know, it's important to think about where people that you're targeting might be looking and also where there might be opportunities for growth. So there is no harm in asking your employees, Hey, when you found us, where were you looking? You know, how did you spot us? What information do you see about us? But I think it's important to kind of spread things around in terms of posting jobs to so many different job boards you post in one place, but it can feed to a few different others.
00:08:55:12 - 00:09:14:06UnknownYeah. And so making sure that the word is out there and that you're getting in front of as many people as possible is really what's important. I think it's also really important to make sure that those posts that you're making give a good amount of information. Oh, love, love, love. Those postings that are the job description copied over.
00:09:14:08 - 00:09:34:22UnknownAnd I especially love when it has like employee signature at the bottom of where it's literally copied over. You know, you really want to make sure that what you're putting out there is tailored to that person is exciting for them, makes them want to read more. Making sure that you're not just putting we have benefits or we have health insurance.
00:09:34:24 - 00:10:04:01UnknownOne of the speakers at the conference recently talked about that, that she was like, I want companies that have that health insurance dentist vision like who care what else and what else. So, you know, highlighting those things that make you unique or are good offerings to your employees and that's where sometimes posting on social media when you do have a heavily employee following is really nice reminders for them to you know making a post.
00:10:04:03 - 00:10:23:16UnknownYou know if you're in May and it's Mental Health Awareness month that you have the offerings and what that all includes making a post about different employee resource groups that you might have, those things are attractive to people who are looking at your company but might also be really good reminders for people who are already there. Absolutely. Yeah.
00:10:23:17 - 00:10:51:21UnknownI would also encourage to post on multiple platforms if you can, just because of what social media algorithms to all of your followers aren't seeing that post, there's actually only about 5% who are seeing your post. So it is good to kind of space it out and do multiple different posts on multiple different platforms. So how can companies really measure the success of the social media posts and recruiting posts?
00:10:52:01 - 00:11:12:12UnknownYeah, so it's all about getting a baseline for what a good post looks like. So that might be taking a look at some of your historical posts and saying, okay, for what we typically do, we have this many views, this many interactions, those things that you can track, you know, you can't necessarily say, okay, did this post lead to a candidate because you don't really know that.
00:11:12:14 - 00:11:36:22UnknownLike, you know, no one says, I saw the LinkedIn post you made on January 1st and it inspired me. No one says that someone in May and I love them. But yeah, you never know when one specific post leads to a candidate. So looking at are we getting views, are we getting interactions, are people sharing it? Yeah, those are the important things that you can do to measure long term.
00:11:36:23 - 00:12:03:19UnknownYes, you can look at what do our applicant numbers look like? Have we seen an increase between quarter one and quarter two when we started posting more heavily in quarter two? But it's all about really kind of making sure that those views and those reactions that you're getting are aligned with what you're looking for. But if you don't know where to start and you know, there's not a lot of companies who are willing to share like we have great views and great, you know, metrics and we're willing to share.
00:12:03:19 - 00:12:32:03UnknownSo you can be a baseline. You have to start with creating your own. And yeah, I totally agree. I think engagement is a huge measure of success with recruiting and social media posts in general, because if you aren't getting the engaged churn you like likes common shares, then maybe now's the time to kind of reevaluate the content that you're posting in, make sure you're speaking to your following, and are you making your posts interactive?
00:12:32:03 - 00:12:55:15UnknownAlso maybe include a poll or include a call to action or something like that? Yeah, exactly. And don't be afraid to respond to some of those comments that you get, even though they might be a little on the negative side, you know, it's better to respond and show that you are engaging with your brand and with what you're posting than to just let those comments get out there and float in.
00:12:55:17 - 00:13:24:01UnknownAnd, you know, but there's a fine line. If you start to see a conversation building, there's no need to shake it off, flood in and say, you know, hey, I think this is great too, or there is a way you can say, Hey, let's take this offline. Yes. You know, depending on how that conversation is going. So but it is you know, we've seen that post perform better when you do, you know, interact with people in the comments, when you do respond, you know, it can get a little cheesy if you're saying great thought on every single comment.
00:13:24:03 - 00:13:41:24UnknownSo have a little variety to it. This is a great example of how you can engage your marketing team. Yes. And say, Hey, marketing, I have this idea for a post. What do you think? And hey, or Hey, marketing, we got this comment and I want to make sure we respond to it. How can we craft something that aligns with our standards?
00:13:42:01 - 00:14:06:10UnknownThings like that are really important to keep that marketing team, you know, engaged in that conversation and make sure that you're aligning to kind of your whole brand. Yeah, I love that. So how can companies and use social media to build up their brand overall and attract these candidates? Yeah. So one of the things that you can definitely do and actually something we haven't touched on yet is Glassdoor and Google reviews.
00:14:06:12 - 00:14:28:06UnknownSo there are so a number of people who are looking at reviews of companies and what their current and former employees are saying they might not be looking before they apply. They might wait until after they apply. But it is really important to make sure that, you know, what you have out there is engaging and is exciting or that you're addressing the ones that might not be as nice.
00:14:28:08 - 00:14:51:02UnknownI've talked to a number of companies that actually have kind of a schedule, so every two weeks they randomly select, you know, a certain amount of people to say, Hey, we want to hear how things are going at ABC Company. Here's the link to Glassdoor. Could you please, you know, leave us a review? And it's a great way to kind of continue to build the reviews that you have on that platform.
00:14:51:04 - 00:15:08:09UnknownA lot of times you see really positive and really negative, but that helps get kind of that in between. And it's the same thing when you're looking at reviews, when you're buying something. I just bought an air fryer this weekend and I looked at the five star and I looked at the one star and I said, okay, now let's get the real story.
00:15:08:09 - 00:15:37:04UnknownAnd I looked at the two, three and four star reviews and said, okay, some of these one stars appear to be user error and appear to be that specific person. So these five stars seem like they were paid to get them. And that's always not good. And it's the same thing in employee readiness. So starting with something like that of just saying, Hey, we'd love to hear your thoughts and get a review, here's the link or Here's a QR code to go fill that out and don't be afraid of Google reviews.
00:15:37:04 - 00:15:59:07UnknownYou know, everyone kind of thinks of Glassdoor right away and Glassdoor and indeed are now combined. And so anything they fill out on Glassdoor also shows and indeed, but so many candidates, when they're searching for jobs, they'll just search project management job and in Google. And then when they're looking in Google jobs, it's showing those Google reviews to that candidate as well.
00:15:59:08 - 00:16:33:11UnknownAnd Google reviews are even easier than Glassdoor because Glassdoor wants you to fill out so much information before you make a room. But also, you know, talking with people like that and then getting though, the true feedback of what's going on is super helpful and in addition, when you look at that, your existing following, you know, maybe you see, okay, we've got a lot of employees, what can we do to help build it so we get potential candidates to and maybe it's talking with your employees and saying, Hey, we've got this post coming out, I'd love for you to share it, you know, so that your friends can see maybe they follow us.
00:16:33:11 - 00:16:58:23UnknownMaybe it's about their referral program or a sign on bonus or anything of that nature. And that can really help because it's way more common for people to follow something or engage in something when someone that they know has shared it versus it being a paid ad. Of course, paid ads are successful. But, you know, that is also a great kind of free way to do it, too.
00:16:59:00 - 00:17:22:08UnknownAnd I would say that if a candidate is applying for jobs on LinkedIn or other social media, chances are they're also going to be checking out that company's LinkedIn page or that company's other social media pages. So if you're a company that doesn't really have a strong LinkedIn page or presence, maybe now's the time to do a little makeover.
00:17:22:10 - 00:17:46:04UnknownAnd if you don't know what to post, I would just encourage you to do company culture Post. So who are your employees look like? What is your office or place of work look like? Posts about your company vision and mission and LinkedIn is good for a thought leadership post. So what can you put out on LinkedIn that your competitors can't put on LinkedIn?
00:17:46:04 - 00:18:09:14UnknownSo when a candidate is going to your LinkedIn page, they see all of that great stuff and it's kind of a reminder to them that, hey, this would be a great place to work, something like that. Yeah, exactly. So what role does content play in social media recruitment and how can companies create really engaging content? Yeah, so again, it kind of plays to what do you want to target?
00:18:09:14 - 00:18:41:20UnknownSo if your content is really focused on opportunities that you have, benefits that you have, it can really help kind of lead to potential candidates if you're able to get that word out. But you know, it's really all about making sure you have enough of a presence that it's clear that you're engaged. It's clear that, you know, you are posting often you're doing things, your website is updated because that can even be something you get so focused on social media and then you have different information on what you post versus what's on your website.
00:18:41:20 - 00:19:01:09UnknownThat's a good point. And so, you know, making sure that content is aligned with everything that you're doing is super important. And, you know, I think when it's really authentic content, when it's stuff that is true to your company and true to what people are saying, it really helps to make people believe it and again, make people want to learn more.
00:19:01:11 - 00:19:24:06UnknownSo what kind of moving into a different zone here? What ethical considerations should companies keep in mind when using social media for recruiting? Yeah, so you really want to make sure that you're not, you know, crossing any lines. You know, you mention it's great to have pictures of people from your company in there. It's also great to make sure they're okay with it first.
00:19:24:08 - 00:19:42:21UnknownAnd if they leave, it's great to get that update too. So if you're in a big company and you know, it's do you don't see a ton of faces as often and you're using someone's picture who left you years ago that someone in your company may not realize that they left two years ago and they're like, well, they've been on the website the whole time.
00:19:42:21 - 00:20:11:14UnknownI thought it was like, well, so, you know, it's things like that you definitely want to take care to know. It's also really important to make sure that you're not, you know, using a brand that isn't necessarily a great trend to tie your business to. Right? There's been some examples recently of businesses that are, you know, jumping on the bandwagon and not really realize what their job began to or using a sound and not really realizing what that sound says.
00:20:11:16 - 00:20:32:18UnknownSo, you know, you want to make sure that you're careful as you're considering content to post and that, you know, if someone were to call somebody and a question that, you know, you can stand by it and not just say, oh, it was a trend. So I thought it was okay. So definitely it can definitely be a little tricky sometimes, too, to navigate that.
00:20:32:18 - 00:20:54:22UnknownAnd there are some large companies who say, you know, we won't use any copyrighted media because we are too worried about running into issues with that, which is totally okay and totally understandable. You know, the the social media world we live in is kind of interesting sometimes with some high content. So, you know, just going hard and fast, but that can definitely keep you protected.
00:20:54:24 - 00:21:21:23UnknownIt obviously also really limits you. I will say some of my favorite content, though, is some of those larger companies that are like, we can't use copyrighted social or copyrighted songs. So this is our intern singing the song for you. Look up stories. No one wants to hear that. Yeah, I think it'd be great. So what advice would you give to companies and to use social media as a recruiting tool for the very first time?
00:21:22:04 - 00:21:46:07UnknownYeah. So for the first time, number one, get your marketing team involved. They are the ones who typically own that website anyways. And so you really need to make sure that you're talking through with them and that you are, you know, getting everything through them. Again. Take a look at that following you already have and try to align that content to what makes sense.
00:21:46:09 - 00:22:07:00UnknownIt's also really important to know that social media is so weird with how things do and don't take offs. There are things that you know, you're like no brainer, this is going to hit and it just gets lost, you know? And so, you know, it's okay to try some different things, do some AB testing, you know, try things out a couple of times On social media.
00:22:07:05 - 00:22:27:23UnknownAgain, nobody knows how the algorithms work. So they're always changing. They're always changing. Yeah. So it's okay to you know, kind of play around with things and but most of all has fun with it. I think people can tell when you're just posting, like, I just got to get this done, posting a poll, how to do it, and so make sure that you're having fun with it.
00:22:28:00 - 00:22:47:11UnknownAlso, don't be afraid to ask people who might not be like kind of that first person you think of social media is a tool that really almost everyone uses, and so it might be a fun learning opportunity for somebody else or like a fun challenge for someone who you typically wouldn't think would want to, you know, to know about recruiting or things like that.
00:22:47:12 - 00:23:22:18UnknownOh, no, There's a lot of different ways you can go about it. There's no right or wrong way other than engage marketing. Good advice. So one is social media not work then one trying to recruit. I again, I'd say if you're just trying to be viral or trying to like, you know, get one thing to really take off, it's probably not going to work if you're just trying to get the word out about your jobs, You know, unless you have a way to make it engaging, to have conversations around it, there probably it probably isn't going to take off.
00:23:22:20 - 00:23:41:24UnknownSo and then if you're starting from like absolute square one, don't assume that your postings are going to get, you know, thousands of views in a day. It's got to be a long term effort. It's got to be something that you're willing to, you know, have put some effort into it. You can't just assume. All right, boom, posted, done.
00:23:41:24 - 00:24:07:19UnknownI can walk away and it's all fine because that's where you're not going to see success. Yeah, and not all companies need to be on all social media platforms. It's quality over quantity. Yes. Yes, absolutely. So kind of wrapping up here, do you have any your real life success stories with social media and recruiting? I got a couple of interesting ones, so I like inside.
00:24:07:21 - 00:24:30:04UnknownI've worked with one company before that asks for those routine reviews from their employees and they've actually seen, I think it was a full star increase over the course of a year, their first year of doing it. And so they gave it that time and, you know, really let it kind of grow and comfort. Employees really appreciate it.
00:24:30:06 - 00:24:53:22UnknownAgain, part of that is that they are following up on some of those things. They're also keeping it completely anonymous. So the person who kind of pulls the names and decides who to reach out to and then deletes the emails that they send and does not keep a record of who they've already reached out to. So there's no way that they can say, Oh, well, we know we reach out to these five, here's this one bad one that we got.
00:24:53:22 - 00:25:23:05UnknownSo it must be one of these five and I'll start to investigate. You got to kind of forget those names and let them go right after. But they've seen great success from it and they saw really interesting things that the employees were saying were pros that they never really thought of as pros. And so it's really great that they were able to kind of like take that step back and see things that people are saying, like, I can't remember the specific, but like, you know, as an example, oh, I love that we have, you know, coffee in the cafe.
00:25:23:07 - 00:25:39:17UnknownAnd they were like, Oh, we do have coffee. And like, that's just a standard. I never in that. But like, that was something in that industry was in, you know, a standard. And so, you know, that can help you to kind of get things that you can highlight in your content or things that you can highlight in your postings.
00:25:39:19 - 00:26:12:12UnknownAgain, really, really great success with that consistency across her postings too. So I've seen, you know, not so success stories of companies that have one thing on their website and then one things on their postings. But when you have that consistent messaging, that consistent language, if you're linking the posting back to your careers page for more information instead of trying to fit everything that you have in your posting, you know, that really helps you to be successful without kind of blurting everything out there and, you know, getting it all in No.
00:26:12:12 - 00:26:36:12UnknownOne post because, you know, posting wise, they do see that there's a certain character limit that you want to stay between and sometimes getting everything about your culture and your values and all of that. It needs to take kind of that second seat, right. And is just on your careers page. So the companies that really focus on, you know, building those postings, building that brand, that's where we've seen some great success.
00:26:36:12 - 00:26:59:08UnknownYeah, absolutely. Well, that's all the time we have today. So thank you again for being here and all the great info you you gave us on social media as a recruiting tool. So listeners, I would just encourage you to like come in and share this podcast and posts and if you enjoyed it or learn something that's great. And also take a look at the resources in the show notes below.
00:26:59:08 - 00:27:17:11UnknownOn becoming an MRA member We also have Kathy's bio and LinkedIn profile in there too, so if you want to get in touch with her, have any questions, she's there for you. The rise will see you next week and thanks for coming on the podcast again. Kathy Thanks again for having me. And that wraps up our content for this episode.
00:27:17:13 - 00:27:35:20UnknownBe sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect For more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA’s 30 minute Thrive so you don't miss out. Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.